This site uses cookies to offer you a better browsing experience. Find out more about how to manage cookies, or dismiss this message and continue to use cookies.

Why does the Nuvi keep trying to take me on back roads?

1235716

Comments


  • I don't think so. If you have avoidances checked and traffic checked in the submenu, if the traffic problem exists at the time of initial routing, it will be included, just as avoid u-turns or any of the other choices for avoidance. The easy way to find out if something like this is going on is to do the same route in simulator mode and see what happens.
    It would be rather ridiculous to avoid a section of roadway in the routing when an incident is 116 miles away (approximately 2 hrs driving time) from the starting point. What are the odds that it will still be causing any delay at that time?
  • I'd like to try this a few more times, but it seems to prove that Garmin isn't allowing for any stop time on local/city streets.

    I agree in principle, but not precisely. There is an implication that the road database doesn't take these things into account. That isn't really correct. They do try to take those things into account. Now if they get it right or not for each road classification/type is another matter-- and likely what you are seeing. But I'll just nitpick on the wording so we don't get any rumors started.

    So based on what you describe, the GPS thinks you will transit the stretch of road faster than you actually likely will. This is a bit different than saying the GPS expects you will hit every light green. While the net result is similar (actual drive slower than projected) the same could be true for any type of road.

    Try this. Run a simulation and see what speed the GPS puts you at for those roads. If it is below the speed limit there is some type of allowance for traffic and lights.



    I mapped a route on Brown Deer Road in the Milwaukee area between Interstate 43 and Hwy 45. This is a city street with a number of stop and go lights. The posted speed is 40 about half of the way and 45 the other half. Garmin says it is 8.8 miles with a time of 11:48. 11:48 is .197 of an hour. 8.8/.197 = 44.7 miles per hour. Obviously Garmin is not considering stop lights at all on this route.

    As reference, Bing says 9.2 miles and 16 minutes (about 35 mph).
  • mikes 0 Points
    Is this what it did?
    That route has a via point in South Orange (the white circle on the route), so it makes perfect sense. Drag the via point onto I91, and the route changes to what you'd expect: this.
  • BullieverBulliever 0 Points
    edited August 2009
    Is this what it did?
    That route has a via point in South Orange (the white circle on the route), so it makes perfect sense. Drag the via point onto I91, and the route changes to what you'd expect:
    It seems you've missed the fact that Tim intentionally created that route to illustrate his question.
  • cuc tu 91 Points
    Yeah, because it would only do that, automatically, on a Garmin...
  • mortfe 0 Points
    I find the same thing. Google Maps give me a choice and the fastest route is not the one Garmin brings up. Is there any way to import a Google map? By the way I'm on a mac. Thanks.
  • jloh 0 Points
    I thoght only my Nuvi goes crazy, insted of going straight it makes me go in circles :evil:
    Be extremely careful, don't let it bite you. Because I think it has rabies!
  • Seems like this thread has dried up. Has anyone heard anything from Gamin? They have not responded on either of the tickets I have opened.
  • Still waiting as well.
  • I totally agree. Again maybe I'm missing something but I can take a 255 with current firmware and maps and a 1350 with current firmware and maps (all preferences identical) and prove that one routes me to Chicago via HWY 41 and the other via I-94. Both using 'fastest time' opton.

    What more do they need?

    Mike
    I don't remember if I mentioned this in my other thread post.. One night when driving from Indiana to Milwaukee there was construction and a bad delay on I-94 north of I-80. When I drive this route, my Garmin wants to take me on I-94 instead of I-294. Guess what? From the traffic, my nuvi changed the route... to go north on US-41 and take that to get through downtown Chicago. Ignored, went on I-294, and my ETA time dropped significantly.

    I've had this issue on my current 1250, a 755T, as well as Nuvi 550. My old StreetPilot didn't do this.

    It almost seems as if some roads are "ignored" as a faster route option.
  • I have seen this a couple of times too. The Garmin will calculate the "fastest route", but I'll stay on what I know to be much faster and the estimated time will drop as soon as it recalculates. I sure wish I would have known how poor the Nuvi's route calcualtion routines were before I bought it. And...it doesn't seem that there are enough people complaining for Garmin to do anything about it. I'm seriously considering trying to sell mine and move to a TOMTOM. I'd feel bad for the poor sucker who bought it though :)
  • Now that i have been using my 855 for more time I too have found it ignoring faster routes i new would be faster and when it recaculates it shows a ETA thats quicker!! I bought the garmin (my first) because it had such high reviews and the reviews i read showed it to give faster routes than tomtom or maggellan. Now iam thinking of getting a tomtom with IQ routing. After all if the tomtom is faster thats what i want. Any brand gps will get you there.
  • SL 0 Points
    I agree with the last 3 posters and whoever is claiming the incorrect Garmin routing. I am thinking to return my 855 but not sure if I will go TomTom or not.
  • jloh 0 Points
    I have seen this a couple of times too. The Garmin will calculate the "fastest route", but I'll stay on what I know to be much faster and the estimated time will drop as soon as it recalculates. I sure wish I would have known how poor the Nuvi's route calcualtion routines were before I bought it. And...it doesn't seem that there are enough people complaining for Garmin to do anything about it. I'm seriously considering trying to sell mine and move to a TOMTOM. I'd feel bad for the poor sucker who bought it though :)
    This has happened to me numerous times, so now when I'm in a familiar area. I just turn off my GPS.

    For some strange reason every time when I take a trip to downtown San Francisco. My garmin tells me to turn right (or maybe left I forget) on Golden Gate Ave, when I'm on Golden Gate Avenue! And no there are no sidestreets named golden gate there. Since I live in SF I just turn off my GPS rather than have to listen to that. Most of the time the routes it suggests, are not the same as the routes I take anyway. The routes it suggests will eventually get me to my destination, though.

    Also by my house there is a fork in the road, one major street the other a minor street. But it does not tell you to which way to go at the fork. So a person who did not know the area could make a mistake and take the wrong fork.
  • My 2610 is so much more accurate than the 765!

    What brand actually routes the "fastest" ????


    bob
  • It is very frustrating traveling a known route and yet Garmin 765T wants to send you miles out of route. Since I know the good route it's not a problem for me but what of a stranger trying to get somewhere? Here in the Phoenix area there are some areas you DO NOT want to be in!

    I have heard every excuse from Garmin tech support and have given up trying to converse with them.

    But, the best scenario as to why nothing is where you know, or think you know something to be, came from a sales associate at Radio Shack. His statement made me giggle, but soon realized he might be correct. According to him, Homeland Security had mandated to the GPS and map makers that correct addresses should not be "very accurate" for security reasons. This supposedly was mandated about 2 years ago and just now the GPS and mapping industries are catching up.

    Far fetched? Not really. But, at least now I don't have to worry about some terrorist's guided missile hitting my home since Homeland Security, the mapping/GPS industry has mapped my home about 500 feet down the street and I park my car in my swimming pool which is at an address for the neighbors about 1000 feet away. The terrorists will never find me now! :roll:
  • Boyd 1985 Points
    His statement made me giggle, but soon realized he might be correct.
    I'd say to go with your first impression there... and stop wasting your time hob-nobbing with Radio Shack salesmen. :D
  • Marc 301 Points
    As to why addresses aren't very accurate, this has been discussed before. Essentially each address is not given an exact geographical location in the map database, but rathe a block of addresses are given a start and stop point. Addresses are linearly interpolated based on this. Of course if the addresses aren't evenly spaced you end up, not quite at the right location. However, this has little to do with strange routing.
  • Since there is not solution for this issue yet - you think TomTom or any other GPS is better and does not have this issue?
  • jloh 0 Points
    Since there is not solution for this issue yet - you think TomTom or any other GPS is better and does not have this issue?
    Yeah here, get this, it'll probably do what you need.


    http://www.l-3com.com/news-events/pressrelease.aspx?releaseID=1196249&category=NA


    But at about 40k a pop, it's too rich for my blood. I'll let you do the review of this one. Perhaps you can get them to send you a freebie?
  • I agree in that the Nuvi no longer takes traffic lights into consideration when calculating travel time - and that's why it takes back roads when highways are really faster. I just updated to a 265 and the first time I used it I noticed the problem. Almost every time I stop at a light, the travel time went up by a minute. My old garmin never did this. They have a serious problem and it needs a fix. It not only gives wrong travel time estimates, it sends you on a longer route!! Someone at garmin has to do something.
  • Let me start off by saying that I think I am highly qualified to comment on this thread relating to the Nuvi 765t and the new update routing off highways and onto slower side roads. I am a musician on the side, and my gigs are all over New Jersey. I own a TomTom One and that GPS would route me via the highway for all my shows, only letting me get off the highway once I was close to my destination. I know the TomTom routing was excellent because I would often get directions from the official club website, and the TomTom followed those directions to a T.

    Cut to a month ago and all the glowing reviews of the Nuvi 765T. I picked one up, and in the course of that month hit the same 10 clubs scattered throughout NJ. In every instance the Nuvi wanted to take me off the highway 10-15 exits BEFORE my destination! These side roads didn't save me any time, they only prolonged it with all the lights and slower speed limits. How can this be anything but an issue that Garmin needs to look at? I even played around with the settings to see if that was the problem...it wasn't. The routing did not change. Still, I'll hold on and hope for a corrected update.
  • One other point I wanted to mention before I shut up. After all this side road routing to my shows I had tickets to a concert in NYC all the way downtown. The Nuvi 765T routed me down 79th street, which is notoriously crowded with traffic and THEN proceeded to take me down Broadway and into the heart of times square!!! I've been driving into NYC for the last 25 years, and know that the easiest route to the concert was the west side highway and then cutting across to east 16th street. The nuvi decided to route me along 2 of the busiest, most congested streets. You may ask why I decided to listen to the Nuvi if I know better...it all came down to me thinking, "huh...does it know a better, faster way?" Stupid I know...and obviously it didn't.
  • Does anyone know how to bring this problem to Garmin's attention? I doubt our comments here will have any effect in getting a fix.
  • Does anyone know how to bring this problem to Garmin's attention? I doubt our comments here will have any effect in getting a fix.
    At one point, the site admin said that Garmin was monitoring this thread... but he's been pretty quite for a while. We've posted specific examples where the routing fails, but have heard nothing. I've opened a couple of tickets with Garmin... but have not heard back from them either. I think the only thing we can do is keep opening tickets with Garmin until someone at Garmin realizes they have a real problem.... or give up and buy a TOMTOM. I'm going to open one more ticket, and if I don't hear anything within a couple of week.... TOMTOM it is. I sure wish I wouldn't have believed all of the glowing reviews I read about the 765T before I bought it. I have to wonder if Garmin paid to have them written.
  • I sure wish I wouldn't have believed all of the glowing reviews I read about the 765T before I bought it. I have to wonder if Garmin paid to have them written.
    I'm not saying Garmin does this, but if they did... I wouldn't be surprised in the least. LOTS of companies "fluff" their products on review sites by posing as "innocent consumers". :roll:
  • Guaranteed that doesn't happen here :)
  • Guaranteed that doesn't happen here :)
    Any Garmin employee could register as a "regular person". How would you know? Also, this is more prevalent on sites like Amazon and such. Consumer sites, of which this one is not.
  • Manufacturer reps have registered here before. AFAIK, we've identified all of them pretty quickly. We do have a few tools at our disposal and having read a few thousand posts it's usually pretty easy to spot one that just doesn't seem right. DHN, Boyd, Tim and myself have gotten pretty good at it. . . especially Tim :wink:
  • Has anyone here used a slightly older Garmin such as 760? I tried out an older 250 in Target and it didn't seem to route as bad, but features-wise that is pretty limited.

    Amazon still has the 760 and 780 and I would consider downgrading if the routing was better.
  • Personally I haven't seen the odd routing at all on my 760, and it does have the very latest maps.
  • Same here for my even older 660 with the latest 2010.20 map. Great routing.
  • I agree with above posts. This is the biggest complain I have about my 765T, it very often picks the slower route! Always prioritize local slow roads with lots of red lights.

    Right outside my house there are two options to go north. One is to take I-95, one is to take the local Rt1. The latter is slightly shorter, but much lower speed limits and lots of red lights. Of all mapping software, Google maps etc, they all pick I95, but garmin insist to take Rt1. No idea why!? When I take I95 anyway, my garmin happily recalculates the new estimated time and whoah.. it's now shows an earlier arrival time!

    So I treat the Garmin GPS device as a last resort if you have extra time, no idea of where you are and looking for the scenic route. And yes, I have the settings to take the faster route.

    One day they may actually fix their routing software to actually take the faster route!!!!
  • Rbirk, seeing stuff like this really makes me glad I got an older Nuvi 660 that has a lot reliable of road use on it from someone I know very well. He let me use it for a few weeks until I finally decided to buy it from him at the screaming price of $125 and that's with lifetime traffic and lifetime map updates (yes, I know...non transferable, but :wink: ). It has the latest 2010.20 map on it and has been virtually flawless every time I've used it. I've made it a point to go on some long drives and did some "pre-flight planning" before I left by comparing the routing to Mapquest and Google Maps. The directions were 95%+ exactly the same and had me arriving within minutes of each other. Not bad at all for a 2-3 hour drive. I'm very happy with it, but I am also very "gun shy" about getting a newer unit when this one finally dies. People were recommending the 700 series to me for around $200 instead of the older 660 WITH extras for $125. I see my decision appears to have been a sound one. 8)
  • I have a 760 and a 765T. The pre-June 765T worked great. Not one failure. But after whatever happened in June 09 nothing has been right since.

    I just might buy the updated maps for the 760 and see if it does any better. If I could just figure out how to get Google map routes into my 765T I would stay with it. Google maps are right on the button as far as route planning. But of course their maps are from TeleAtlas and not Navteq.
  • Using GPSBabel or GMapToGPX software, you should be able to convert the Google route to GPX for use with your nuvi. I haven't personally used either one for that so no guarantees.

    There's a good explanation on GMap here:
    http://www.elsewhere.org/journal/gmaptogpx/
  • One of the most important reasons I got the 765T was the live traffic. I wanted to be able to use it locally to help avoid bad traffic when going to work, out to dinner... wherever. Unfortunately, since the Nuvi's routing is so messed up, I never know if it is routing me off the highway because of traffic or because it's just messed up. I'd have to click on the "search for traffic" button to see if it is registering anything. I'd love to upgrade to the new connected TOMTOM, but they charge $10 a month for the service... plus $40 a year for updated maps. Seems a bit pricey compared to the MSN Direct service (lifetime) and Garmin lifetime maps.

    I'm still hoping Garmin fixes the issue... but hope is running thin.

    Just curious.... does anyone have a new 765T with the 3.8 software? Just wondering (hoping) they may have fixed something with the new version.
  • alanb 539 Points
    If I could just figure out how to get Google map routes into my 765T I would stay with it. Google maps are right on the button as far as route planning. But of course their maps are from TeleAtlas and not Navteq.
    Even if there was a way to transfer routes from Google, you need to realize that the only thing that gets transferred to a nuvi when you import a route is the start point, finish point and any waypoints or vias you set explicitly. The nuvi always recalculates the route using it's own routing algorithm. So you can get the exact same results by setting the same waypoints manually on the nuvi.

    That said, I do like to use DeLorme Street Atlas USA, Mapsource, Google and MapQuest when planning routes, just to compare their routes. I think Street Atlas USA is my favorite because it is very easy to add via's along a desired route before transferring it to the nuvi.
  • Even if there was a way to transfer routes from Google, you need to realize that the only thing that gets transferred to a nuvi when you import a route is the start point, finish point and any waypoints or vias you set explicitly. The nuvi always recalculates the route using it's own routing algorithm. So you can get the exact same results by setting the same waypoints manually on the nuvi.
    You're right. Even sending that route to a TomTom can have the same results even tho they do use TA maps. Proper, and sometimes numerous, waypoint placement is needed to get the same route. Even then it doesn't always work exactly as planned.
  • So we should just wait and hope that they will someday update their algorithm for actual fast routes! What I dont get is - since this is an actual problem how come its getting so many rave reviews from so many users?? I am sure if its routing back road routes to some then it must be doing the same to all!!!
  • I'm not sure it is. The xx5's are the biggest selling pnds series in the US, but there hasn't been all that much noise about the routing issues mentioned here anywhere else. A post here and there but nothing to indicate that everyone with those models has routing problems. I will say it's about time for Garmin to step up and at least indicate what they know about it. We already have been told they are aware of complaints and have even followed this thread. Yet no acknowledgement from Garmin whether there's an identified issue and if so, how will it be addressed. It doesn't affect any of the devices prior to the xx5's as far as I can see, and with literally 10's of thousands of different model of xx5's in user hands, you'd certainly think there would be a bigger outcry if all of them were affected. A response from Garmin would also be fairly quick based on past instances that affected entire model series. Not necessarily fixed, but at least an attempt at it accompanied by an admittance. I really don't know what to make of it, but a response from Garmin is absolutely needed IMO. Those that feel something's not right and have their evidence to prove it deserve some indication as to where the origin is and whether/when it will be addressed.
  • Absolutely! So what is that we can do to get their attention?
  • jloh 0 Points
    Absolutely! So what is that we can do to get their attention?
    The most obvious one guys, don't buy garmin! But I doubt seriously that's gonna happen. Especially since I went in to Best Buy one day and wanted to know what they knew about GPS's, which is not much, but they seemed to be pushing Garmins. They had TomToms and Magellan's, maybe a few more. But they didn't know all that much.

    So it's kinda the blind leading the blind.
  • Tim 1480 Points
    (Not completely related to this thread, but something useful to me and I think people have mentioned it in this thread.)

    Can somebody provide me with a route (exact starting address and ending address) that you can then add a specific via point to (exact address) and the new route with the via shows (by the Nuvi's own estimate) is shorter in time than the original route?

    Example: from 123 main st, anytown, ST to 321 Maple Ave, another town, ST gives an estimated time of 1:20 but if I add a via at such and such address the Nuvi says it will take 1:15.
  • Absolutely! So what is that we can do to get their attention?


    The most obvious one guys, don't buy garmin! But I doubt seriously that's gonna happen. Especially since I went in to Best Buy one day and wanted to know what they knew about GPS's, which is not much, but they seemed to be pushing Garmins. They had TomToms and Magellan's, maybe a few more. But they didn't know all that much.

    So it's kinda the blind leading the blind.
    I wish i can do that! Its already past a month since I got my new piece and cant return it now :cry: ...I should have noticed it sooner... and the $189 tag still hurts especially since its not working as desired.
  • I was able to speak to a Garmin salesperson who frequents the store I work in. He mainly sells the off-road Garmins and was unaware of any problems with the Nuvii units.

    He says he will contact his rep to see what the ruckus over bad navigation is. If he gets an answer that makes sense then I will post his reply here.
  • This issue is a hot potato, I think it seems to be worse in the US than here in the UK, the routes I get are generally similar to Google Maps.

    I think its rare for a reroute through urban areas or country roads to be quicker than a highway/motorway etc, even if you have to sit in gridlock for a while, so any such reroutes sound very foolish.

    I suspect that internally Garmin are (or should be) frantically looking at incorporating Navteq's Traffic Patterns into their routing, from what I have heard IQR has really transformed TomTom's latest devices and leave Garmin kicked to the kerb in this area.

    It's only the fact I have heard such shocking reports about the TT home software and even more ropey support than Garmin that has put me off.

    The question then is if they do incorporate it will it be available to current users as a map and firmware update, or will we have the joy of junking our current devices to buy yet another new model?

    It would be a potentially good PR exercise if it can be cascaded down to current owners I think.

    The lack of memory on the 2xx series mean it would be unlikely to be capable of running extra map data, but the other current models should be ok I would think.

    The heart of a good GPS is to get you to your destination in the quickest possible time, and TT seem to be in the lead at the moment, even if you do blow up your device when connected to the PC!!

  • For those not familiar with the area, Brooklyn (Kings County) and Queens County along with Nassau and Suffolk counties are part of Long Island. The is no town, village or city named Long Island, NY.
    Hmmm... I believe there is Long Island City, NY.

    http://www.google.com/search?q=long+island+city+ny&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a
  • Has anyone here used a slightly older Garmin such as 760?
    I have a 750 running the latest software updates (older map but nothing ancient) and I've found quirks in the routing. For instance, I was going from the Beach area of east Toronto to northwest Toronto by the airport and the logical routing would have been this:

    http://tinyurl.com/y8zsytb

    and in fact Google came up with this. Faster because it's all highway but not necessarily the shortest, most direct route.

    However, what the 750 came up with was this:

    http://tinyurl.com/yaasssn

    which made no sense whatever. Routing up Bayview Avenue would include not a few traffic lights not to mention a couple of pretty regular radar traps. If I didn't know Toronto, I would've been pretty aggravated to have been going overland like this instead of using highway all the way.

    Regardless of the shortest/fastest routing preference, I think the nuvi routing algorithm prioritises for the shortest distance between two places and then will search out minor variations that may improve travel time.
  • dhn 336 Points
    Interesting......

    For laughs, I selected the same route in my TomTom which has IQ routing and purposely selected a departure time of 3:30 pm on a weekday. We know the DVP is a parking lot at that time of day.

    The TT's routing (also using Googe's TeleAtlas map BUT implementing IQ routing which Google maps doesn't) did NOT use the DVP at all. It chose Lakeshore Road, the Gardiner, 427 to the 401 to Islington.

    In case you don't know, IQ routing takes into consideration historical data of actual driving experiences on roads for a specific time of day and day of the week'. So it picked a route 'knowing' about rush hour.

    If I selected a departure time of 3:30 AM, the DVP may have been selected.
Sign In or Register to comment.
↑ Top