Review of Nuvi 3590, after Two Months of Use

I recently upgraded from my loved and trusty Nuvi 855 to Garmin’s latest: the 3590. I have owned the 3590 for two months now; these comments are based primarily on an almost 4,000 road trip, combining 8 long freeway days, plus two weeks of intensive point-to-point local travels during those vacation days. Short Story: I am super pleased with most features. I offer these comments to help other owners of the 855/885 (and the near siblings, 755/760) to decide if the 3590 has enough improvements to entice them to upgrade. I have owned the 855 since May 2009, but after reading about each successive new Nuvi (i.e., 14xx, 16xx, and all the 2xxx models), felt that none were good enough to make me switch. Now, I am so happy with the 3590, that my 855 appears to have an uncertain future as just a “backup.”

[NOTE to Forum Moderator: You are welcome to relocate this Review elsewhere, perhaps to replace my earlier version of April 26, which is currently displayed as a “Sticky.” THESE comments are much revised from my earlier report, and thus more informative.]

The 3590 has been available since about February 2012. I bought it after reading only a minimal number of Amazon reviews. It is rare for me to act on such a new product, and with so little information. However, THE prime mover for me was the professional review posted at GPStracklog, by Rich Owings (posted April 9, at: http://gpstracklog.com/2012/04/garmin-nuvi-3590lmt-review.html ). His review is packed with useful screen displays, and his informed judgments about the features, plus compares some key features with recent Nuvis. The 3590 is still the most expensive Nuvi (currently $380 US), and you just have to decide if its features are worth it to YOU.

I invite owners of other recent Nuvis (such as the 3790, 2360, 2495, 2595, and 3490) to chime in here with comments regarding my 3590 descriptions…and how well those features operate on THEIR predecessor models. I reference those models because they contain many of the same 3590 features, such as Lifetime Maps and Traffic, as well as Lane Assistance and Junction View. Most also have the improved Nuvi Search engine, multiple customizations of menus, and Trip Planner. In addition, I wish to draw attention to the addition of the 3590 enhancement with Voice Command, a 5-inch screen, Smartphone with Bluetooth, and live traffic reports without ads...plus a few other functions. I have NO experience with the other recent Nuvis, and thus cannot compare their actual quality of performance with the 3590; however, if prospective buyers think that the similar named features (most important to you) would function as well as on the 3590, perhaps you should consider buying those now less expensive models.

MAIN FEATURES OF 3590:
Map Display, and Lifetime Maps and Live Traffic Reports – I happen to really like the split screen display of Junction Views with the current Map view, right down to seeing my auto migrate along an exit lane and down the off ramp. I like the newly termed “Birds Eye View” for lane guidance (more detailed, overhead graphic view) at complicated cloverleaf off ramps, but don’t perceive any significant difference from my 855 (with Map Updates). I have been amazed at the extreme accuracy of 3590 Traffic Alerts: My experience has mostly been on distant freeways, but have also have viewed them several times at home: You might see a RED Traffic icon and tap it to read about a delay 10 miles ahead, and then get an audible beep 1-2 miles ahead if the alert is still deserved, AND these warnings have been spot on, as we reach the map marked delay. So far, I have encountered on “false alerts,” although one did diminish to a Yellow. Garmin lists about 80 U.S. metro areas where this its new “HD radio frequency delivered traffic reports” are supposed to be available. The 3590 comes with a GTM-60 cable (with updates delivered directly thru the cable itself, via NAVTEQ and its data compiled from local radio stations in each metro market). My experience so far is that the 3590 is far more accurate and current than this feature was back on the original 760 (and I never had any Traffic alert function on the 855). It is very important to me that 3590 Traffic Alerts are completely ad-free, as compared to the free version on 2xxx Nuvis, which are ad-supported. I expect that I will use the 3590 a lot during use of local freeways, which I definitely did not expect when I bought it.

Lifetime Maps – I have previously enjoyed this feature on the 855, primarily because the Map Updates have been bringing a steady increase in the number of Lane Assistance and Junction Views, which I consider one of the main guidance features on Nuvis. [Contrast this with the long Garmin delays in providing LA and JV, which were highly touted in 2009-2010, but were hardly seen by most 7xx and 8xx owners during their first year.] I have also been pleased at Map downloads taking just exactly one hour, using Garmin’s “Manage Maps” (and “option 2”) process.

Voice Command – I consider that being able to speak to the Nuvi and perform various functions while driving as one of its most important features. The biggest improvement with Voice Command on the 3590 is that I can speak while the CD player is on a moderate volume, and with car windows open; I have also read of others who do not seem to achieve this success. I enjoy the fact that using VC brings up a screen displaying the 13 commands, prompting one to decide what to speak. I find that VC is very responsive to for most functions, and accurately responds with appropriate choices for most “FIND” searches of City, Place, Category, Saved, Favorites, Volume, Brightness, Stop Route, and Go Home. We used VC with Search functions multiple times every day while in unfamiliar towns, and absolutely loved it: We never had to stop and use manual entry for our daily travels, and frequently used FIND Place / Category for places not previously Searched; NOTE: However, that I would also routinely Search out the names of places and businesses the night before, enabling me to easily draw many of those sites from Recently Found and Saved Places, the next day. [However, in comparison to the 855, I will most miss the ability to speak “Zoom In” and “Zoom Out,” and say “Next Turn” (to display the Junction View), all while motoring along in Map View. Despite having many fewer commands, I find myself using VC on the 3590 routinely, even just to change Volume; I used VC extensively during our trip in unfamiliar places, and routinely delighted both my wife and I with its utility in combination with the Search function: We think VC is now a key Nuvi feature. In fact, I would urge anyone considering any new Nuvi to make it a mandatory feature, and force yourself to become very comfortable in using it, over and over, until it becomes second nature while driving.

Search – In addition to the limited ability of the 3590 to Search by VOICE for the above described functions, I am extremely delighted at the tremendous improvement in conducting Searches (for whatever) by HAND. Whether by hand or VC, Search returns of the expected POIs is much faster than before. I find it much easier to enter Searches with the two boxed displays at the top of a “Where To” search screen, as well as in “Search Category.” The Garmin Manual does an unusually excellent job of explaining Search, on pages 8-13, and new users should read them carefully. If you search with common sense, one can minimize the anguish of looking for a place name or address in a completely inappropriate category (or city or state). This is a tremendous improvement over the manual Search function on the 855. [How many 7xx and 8xx users are STILL frustrated with the Nuvi keyboard delays, while making some Search entries?]

Volume – It’s hard to believe that it took so long for Garmin to make the Nuvi loud enough to be easily heard in my car cabin (especially with wind noise and music playing, at highway speeds), let alone that it automatically raises and lowers the volume as needed. [Low Volume was one of the most frequent 855 user complaints.] I have no trouble hearing it describe upcoming turns, or speaking to me in response to my Voice Commands. I very much like the powered mount with its additional (larger) speaker, rather than the small speaker on the back of the Nuvi (for hand-held use). I also have NO problem understanding either the Jack or Jill voices, although they do distort beyond 80% (but are still good enough at that point).

Trip Planner – I had long read of dissatisfaction online with this function, ever since its introduction in the 3790. I truly dreaded having to give up my old feature of “Custom Routes,” for what I believed to be this TP disaster. However, it seems that Garmin improved it markedly within the past year, such that individual “trip segments” within a multi-stage Route now flow (almost) seamlessly when the vehicle is moving. I read now of recent upgrades in the firmware for earlier Nuvis with Trip Planner, and assume that users are now happier with it. Once I got used to it, I had no trouble creating and editing half a dozen routes before the road trip, and carefully inserted specific waypoints with the touch of a finger in Map Browse mode. I have NOT experienced the crazy performance that others have previously reported with TP “trip segments” being disconnected from one another and having to End one, and click to Start another. Such customizing of trip routes (and their actual performance) are crucial for my keeping the 3590. By the way, using fingers to scroll the map screen is also much welcome on the 3590.

Basically, I find Trip Planner on the 3590 to operate virtually indistinguishable from the “Custom Routes” I enjoyed using on the 855 (both for planning AND operational performance). The 3590 TP Route flows smoothly from one labeled Segment right into another, when I have carefully placed “Browse Map” finger taps AFTER each planned road junction. Thus, the magenta line reaches a gold flag on the map, the flag disappears, and the map quickly displays a new magenta line on down the road for the next Segment.

Exit Services – I strongly wanted this feature when I first read of it in earlier Nuvis. I like the apparent functionality of knowing up to five freeway exits ahead, as to what is available at each for food, fuel, lodging, and restrooms. We found ourselves not using this feature during our road trip, mainly because we are McDonald’s addicts, and usually plan our road breaks around those fine establishments (lunch, restrooms). However, we did explore it extensively one afternoon, and can see that it should be highly desired by most folks: It really is easy to use, and offers a lot of flexibility in Search of the 4 provided categories. If nothing else, it should give my co-pilot wife (and all other co-pilots) something to do while we motor down freeways; it would be unsafe for drivers to use it extensively.

5-inch Screen and Map Display – Despite hoping that text size would be bigger, I find that the larger screen has text fonts the same size as before (I viewed the 855 and 3590 side-by-side). Although the 3590 screen is supposed to be a sharper display, my eyes do NOT detect a difference. The only difference is that the 3590’s obviously displays a larger area. I also realized that the 855 screen background is a bright white, versus gray on the 3590. My opinion is that both are equally readable. Just a potential tip to some: By using an air vent mount, I have the Nuvi as close as possible to my eyes, and it is significantly easier for me to read than on a dash mount.

I also like the 3590 bright display screen, which has been registering seemingly instant refreshes as we move and turn. I initially regretted that the device no longer speaks “recalculating:” I liked hearing it speak to me when I made wrong turns. However, after 4,000 miles of practice, I have gotten used to other cues that the 3590 provides (like a yellow line, temporarily replacing the magenta route). In addition, due to my Navigation Settings, when the Nuvi tells me to “make a U-turn,” I do realize that I made a recent mistake (sometimes a quarter mile or so after the fact).

I also like the new feature of displaying Upcoming Street Names (when NOT on a route), in the top green line above the map. I think that the 3590 is just as inadequate as the 855 regarding warning time before turns as did the 855: At highway speeds, I get the next-to-last warning about .7 miles ahead of a turn; at one local street intersection, I last get the warning at 200 feet, JUST as I am about to enter the left turn lane. On the other hand, I do admit that the 3590 gave satisfactory “last warnings” on local streets during our recent road trip.

Browse the Map – A new feature allows users to “Browse” the map. It activates when you scroll the map, which takes it out of routine Navigation mode (and shows a small arrow at bottom left). In Browse, a small “black magnifying glass is displayed at the right side of the map, which with a further touch displays a range of possible POI categories that you can mark on the map: Choose restaurants, or gas, etc., and Blue Dots will appear on the map (if zoomed in far enough), signifying chosen POI locations. Tap on any one, and a window pops up identifying it by name. This feature would be more useful than a regular FIND Place for, say, gas stations (which would appear in list form, with distance and direction to EACH one); with Blue Dots, one might choose to simply drive towards where most of the Blue Dot gas stations are…and then look for one with cheap gas. You could do the same if searching for dining, if you would be satisfied just driving to a major arterial with lots of restaurants, and making your on-the-spot decision that way. I’m guessing that Browse has even more functionality that I have yet to learn.

Customization of Map Buttons and “Where To” Shortcuts – Users can now place 3 optional buttons on the right side of the display (choosing from a list of 12 items), giving easy access to YOUR desired functions (I’ve chosen Trip Computer, Exit Services, and Traffic Reports); the remaining functions are easily accessed via a small icon at the bottom right corner of the map display. Further, one can also choose to display “Map Layers” on screen (any one OR all of Traffic, Trip Log, POI’s, 3D Buildings, 3D Terrain), via another button on the left of the map. You can also customize the “Where To” function screen, with additional user selected “shortcut” icons for up to 36 functions, as well as specific Search Categories (fuel, Starbucks, restaurants, addresses, and on and on). Another new feature is the ability to display certain info in a Nuvi “Dashboard,” at the bottom of the screen (in 4 data fields,” such as elevation, arrival time, distance to destination, speed, etc.). I knew when I first saw these “data fields” on pix of the 2xxx models that I wanted them, and am now pleased to have them.

Alternate Routes – Each time you select a single point destination, you MAY be offered more than one route. The primary will be a function of your default menu choice for “fastest” or “shortest,” while you can also view an alternate route chosen by the unit; I have not yet noticed if more than one alternate is provided. Your choice for that specific destination does not change the default Setting for preferred Navigation (fastest/shortest.] I find the choices to be useful, if for nothing else than to observe that a reasonable Alternative Route exists: Both are displayed on a common preview map, with the primary in Blue and the Alternate in Yellow, and both have time/distance summarized.

I think it extremely unfortunate that the Manual does NOT explain how to view Alternate Routes, nor the accompanying Search result line, underneath returned POI Search results…where it displays a three part line labeled: Routes - i - Go . This is too hard to explain here, but go to page 20, and compare the brief description for “Previewing Multiple Routes” with what one sees after getting a list of choices from any Search. Missing is any mention that one can tap “Routes,” to choose between a Recommended and Alternate Route, or that the small, white - i - button brings up the name, address, phone # of that POI; nor instruct HOW you can Save that POI into Saved Places. Instead, seeing that line basically leads some (most?) persons to simply tap “Go,” like I did for several weeks, before realizing how the rest of that feature really works. Grrrr

Custom Avoids – Users can choose between either Avoid Area or Avoid Road. This is an easy to use feature that I had on the 855, and now it is even easier to operate. I have already blocked out a local toll bridge, and chose to block out a specific area on a forthcoming trip (the Nuvi’s default route would have taken me where I did not want to go). My only experience to date has been that the 3590 does NOT always honor my request for the blocked out toll bridge, at least when I preview Alternate Routes: Perhaps this is to simply remind me that the Alternate Route option does exist, if I want to stop being so cheap!]

Advanced Detours – If enabled in Settings, this allows drivers to select how far away from their intended route they will drive (up to 5 miles, I believe), in response to either Live Traffic Reports, or some other unexpected road slowdown. I had no occasion to activate a Detour during our trip, although I did a pretend Detour, just to see how it would operate…and it seemed as if it would be useful. This feature operated in smooth conjunction with the Traffic Reports, i.e., a Detour will apparently be offered if the live traffic report presents a “serious enough” delay. During two Red Traffic Alerts, I was offered an option for Detour: Both times it brought up what amounted to a “split screen,” comparing the Existing vs. the Alternate Route; we chose to continue on Existing, and both traffic delays cleared up quickly.

Smartphones and Bluetooth Links - Users with “Smart phones” and Bluetooth connection have a range of additional features that they can pay extra for, such as Weather, Fuel Prices, receive Text Messages, and Eco Route.

Satellite Acquisition – Satellite connections have been very speedy, usually within 15 seconds when starting the unit from Sleep mode; I find it also faster coming from a full Off position. This has certainly been much faster than for the 855. The only losses of signal occurred repeatedly in an open, concrete underground garage, and also beneath heavy tree canopy in a downtown “concrete canyon” (signal restored a few blocks later, away from the trees. When the unit is properly mounted on my car air vent, the signals from 5-8 satellites have also registered very strong (mostly full blue bars) , and nearly always displays “10 feet accuracy;” I could get a stronger signal, with more satellites, if I chose a “beanbag” mount. Speaking of Power Off, how many 855 owners will welcome the fact that the 3590 gives you the choice of not just putting it to “Sleep,” but also truly “Off?” So far, I rarely turn it totally off, and find it maintains good battery life until the next use. Garmin claims 3-4 hours of battery life when in hand-held mode.
Speaking of SPEED, the 3590 is notable for working much faster than the old 855. Search returns are faster, initial satellite acquisition is faster, map redraws are faster (and no longer with the phrase “recalculating:” the magenta line just redraws itself very quickly and quietly). The screen also scrolls easily with finger taps or squeezes. Combined with multiple Customization features (discussed above) AND improved easy-to-use design of screen choices, virtually everything on the 3590 seems to work faster than before. Perhaps the best example of the value of VC was the SPEED at which I could perform a Search: We routinely made decisions to change a point-to-point destination at a moment’s notice, and had the result displayed (complete with new route), usually within a minute or two; when I was able to draw POIs from Recently Found or Saved Places, the reroute took perhaps 30 seconds. We thought it was awesome that we could do all that while driving, especially on city streets, where we could completely reverse course in just a couple blocks.

DISLIKES with 3590 – There was quite a variety of things I did NOT like with the 3590, but honestly, it wasn’t any different than my experience with the 855, or what I have read about more recent Nuvis in various GPS forums. These usually rose to the level of “Quirks and Glitches,” but for me, none were what others might perceive as “deal breakers.” Sure, I didn’t like frequent screen glare, but countered that with manual mount adjustments when necessary (or temporary shading with my hand), which is easy to do with the Nuvi on a vent mount. I encountered three instances of the screen going black, but a quick press on the Power button and VCI, I would Reset the unit and re-establish the route (which did come back automatically once), making “frozen Nuvi” just an inconvenience. Yes, we had a variety of glitches, but all Nuvis are subject to occasional strange routes, or instances where you have to repeat the VC more than a few times,or receive an instruction to bear left when it really means TURN left, and a couple of notable junctions where the instruction was the opposite of what should have been: YIKES!

The usual complaints about the online Garmin Manual continue, i.e., it badly needs more detailed explanations of features and accompanying screenshots, so that users don’t have to literally discover some features by accident: That applied directly to me regarding the Alternate Routes and Browse by Map functions! I greatly benefitted in learning the 3590 from previous experience with the 855, plus the miscellaneous information picked up in this and other forums over the past three years. I do think that the Nuvi onboard HELP (in Apps) is a decent substitute for the online Manual, and would be useful to newbies in a variety of situations “on the road.”

I could easily go on about how Garmin can create great products, but do a pathetically awful job of explaining to its buyers on how to use them. TIP to Garmin: Pictures are still “worth 1,000 words.” Multiple screenshots on p. 27 would greatly enhance the descriptions of Map Perspective (to show differences between Track Up vs. North Up vs. 3-D, Map Buttons (to show sample configurations), and Map Dashboard to show samples of different data fields). And that just addresses page 27.

CONCLUSION – Overall, we are very pleased with 3590 performance. I wouldn’t want to try any other Nuvi, with the expectation it would outdo the 3590 in OVERALL operation. The various glitches usually just amounted to either an entertaining diversion and discussion between us (Why did it do THAT?), or just gave me further opportunities to resolve the problem “on the move,” and continue to enjoy the 3590 make our driving lives infinitely easier than without it. Without trying to sound cocky, I have become very confident that I can face virtually any 3590 problem and solve it pretty quick, without having to look through the onboard Nuvi HELP manual; with any other difficulty or quirk I expect to counter with a workable alternative, and “still get there” without a significant delay.

I apologize for any mistakes or wrong assumptions about earlier Nuvis, but have tried to be accurate in this report. I certainly do not intend to slight any of those models. On the other hand, I am sure that some of my enthusiasm for the 3590 is simply due from coming from such a relatively ancient 855…and being amazed at some of the new features, which others have long known about. I have tried not to mislead anyone with descriptions that are overly enthusiastic.
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Comments

  • Boyd 1311 Points
    NOTE to Forum Moderator: You are welcome to relocate this Review elsewhere
    Unfortunately the moderator tools are very limited here. We can edit posts, delete posts/threads and move whole threads to different forums. But that's about it. Since it's a review of a Nuvi, I think it's already in the correct forum.
  • popej 52 Points
    You might see a RED Traffic icon and tap it to read about a delay 10 miles ahead
    I miss useful feature form old nuvis, where next to icon was displayed estimated delay time. Digging menus is wrong solution.
    Basically, I find Trip Planner on the 3590 to operate virtually indistinguishable from the “Custom Routes”
    This probably was Garmin idea, when they introduced trips 2 years ago. But for me they failed. Trips don't work correctly when you bypass VIA, perform a search near route or there are traffic warning ahead. And trips aren't supported on PC.
  • sviking 141 Points
    Love my 3790T except for when the screen acts slowly when responding to input. I'm talking like 5+ seconds from the "boop" sound to actually doing something. Garmin said to fully shut it down from time to time to "clear" stuff out and it's also the only way to re-calibrate the screen since it automatically does it on a cold start. Fine, okay...but it seems like I have to do it ALL the damned time... :roll:
  • nuvifan 0 Points
    I offer the following comments about my experience in overcoming Screen Glare on the Nuvi 3590.

    I noted in the above review that I was sometimes affected by “screen glare from bright or reflected sunlight, but usually just adjusted the angle of the Nuvi to compensate (which is easy with the vent mount so close).” Actually, that glare was just an annoyance to me, but it seems that some others find it a constant irritant (based on comments here and at Amazon.com); it’s even more serious to a few who let it become a “deal breaker,” and returned the 3590. The following advice may help others to better enjoy the wonderful 3590.

    Previously, I countered glare with tiny adjustments of the 3590 to the right or left, but which still left portions of the screen reflecting light. Glare was less of a distraction, but would still persist on one side or the other, depending on the car’s turns. Yet, I was satisfied to “just live with it.”

    Thanks to a recent comment in this forum (I believe it was by “Boyd,” but cannot relocate it), I experimented with my unit and found that his solution works well:

    Now, I TILT THE NUVI JUST A BIT UPWARDS (towards the car roof), until I find a “sweet spot” where there is NO GLARE anywhere on the screen. This is so simple, that I’m disgusted that I never thought of it by myself, i.e., to turn the Nuvi UPWARDS. I haven’t previously read of anyone else with this simple suggestion. It takes just a gentle touch to reposition the 3590 to suit me perfectly.

    I purposely drove in all directions yesterday, just to “road test” this solution in bright sunshine. Once I set the mount correctly, I did NOT have to readjust it, in response to turns. Perhaps it makes a difference that I have the 3590 on an Arkon Vent Mount, located in the center of the dash, and just above the radio: I don’t know how this trick will work on “beanbag” or “friction” mounts, which are set atop the dashboard. I look forward to hearing from others who try this solution to screen glare.
  • Boyd 1311 Points
    Thanks to a recent comment in this forum (I believe it was by “Boyd,” but cannot relocate it)
    Yes, I suggested tilting the device to reflect the ceiling of your vehicle, which is usually the darkest part. The reason you couldn't find it is because I posted that on another site. :wink:

    I came across this trick when rigging a homebrew mount for a glossy screen netbook in my car a few years ago. Glad that it helped you. :D
  • Any reason why a matte screen protector isn't an option?

    I just picked up a 3590LMT from Fry's and it's a HUGE improvement over my 2460LMT.

    Don
  • Does this model support importing of gpx format routes like the 7xx did? I still use mapsource extensively to plan road trips, and having this functionality is #1 on my list. If it can't do it, the gps is useless to me :(
  • t923347 203 Points
    The 3590 supports transfer of routes from Mapsource but, unlike the 7xx model, they appear on the Nuvi in Trip Planner as there is no Routes facility. Trips and Routes are similar but you will notice many differences between the 2 functions once you have seen how Trip Planner operates.
  • Thanks for the reply.

    Does this trip planner function modify my original route in any way? My routes are as far off the beaten path as you can get while still being on a paved road (motorcycle).
  • Boyd 1311 Points
    All current nuvi models will recalculate the route when it is imported. For best results, use the same map on your computer and GPS. You can do this by connecting the 3590 and running Basecamp. It will directly access the map on the 3590 so you can plan your routes. You can also install the same version of the map on the computer as part of the update process.
  • Boyd, this was the behavior with the 765t when importing. Ultimately, the route was ~99% identical compared to the mapsource one. I usually compared mileages. If they were within a mile or less of each other, I considered it a good import.

    Does this model also hide the via point flags, or those are all shown? I ran the 765t with the TW firmware which did this. From my research the US version for the same device did not hide them. What is the behavior of the 3590 in this respect?
  • t923347 203 Points
    If you look at the map showing your full Trip it does show the flag for each via point and your final destination.

    Trip Planner is different than the Routes function on your 7xx in that when you select the Trip the Nuvi will ask you which via point you want as your "next destination". This will normally be your first via point and when that is selected you will only be directed to that point. I believe there is a "flag" shown for that destination.

    Once you reach your first destination (first via point) the Nuvi should then calculate to the next via point. Again, I believe the flag shows for that point. The Nuvi will continue this process of only calculating from one point to the next, until you reach your final destination.
  • ^^Really??? Some of my routes have as many as 50+ via's (shaping points). Sounds like I will have to buy the device and try it out to see if I can live with this sort of behavior. Typical garmin; 1 step forward, 2 steps back.
  • t923347 203 Points
    Would probably be best as the Trip Planner is very different from the routes function your used to. Some folks find it's exactly what they what from the GPS and others, maybe most others, find the old Routes system more to thier liking.
  • Hmm... What I'd really like is something with the functionality of the 765t with respect to custom routes, but with the processing power/video of the current nuvi.
  • Boyd 1311 Points
    I really don't think such a nuvi exists. The 1490 is the only remaining nuvi that supports "classic" routes. You might look at the Zumo series instead which is intended for motorcycles but should still support classic routes and also provide features like junction view.

    The Montana is another new device supporting routes (you can store 200 of them) and other advanced features. It doesn't support junction view or traffic receivers though.
  • Got the 3590 in hand and I see what you all have been trying to tell me. This is truly a blunder. Appears the device no longer differentiates between a waypoint and a via/shaping point.

    Tried running the route through the unflag utility. Resultant gpx wasn't readable by even mapsource. Need an updated unflagger to handle the new gpx files.

    I like the new features - higher res display, rotatable screen, pinch/zoom, faster cpu, etc. But this routing nonsense is a critical feature given all my road trips are meticulously designed.

    If there was no interaction required when the new segment starts, that'd be one thing. Seems I have to redesign the routes now with shaping points on actual roadways rather than intersections. Else by the time I get there I may not know which way to go.
  • t923347 203 Points
    If there was no interaction required when the new segment starts, that'd be one thing. Seems I have to redesign the routes now with shaping points on actual roadways rather than intersections. Else by the time I get there I may not know which way to go.
    As I mentioned in an earlier post, when you start a "trip" you'll be asked which waypoint you wish to be directed to first. If you pick the first one, and then drive to it, the Nuvi should then start you on the next segment without any intervention on your part. Continuing to arrive at each waypoint should result in you being directed to the next one without having to actually go into the 'trip" and select it.
  • As I mentioned in an earlier post, when you start a "trip" you'll be asked which waypoint you wish to be directed to first. If you pick the first one, and then drive to it, the Nuvi should then start you on the next segment without any intervention on your part. Continuing to arrive at each waypoint should result in you being directed to the next one without having to actually go into the 'trip" and select it.
    The nuvi will automatically switch to the next via and the next segment of the trip, but only if you are sufficiently close to the via to trigger completion of that trip segment.

    Gpz1100 is right that you don't want to put your via at an intersection. The Trip Planner only shows the magenta line and associated navigation directions for the current segment of the trip, so putting a via at an intersection might not give you enough warning for where to go next. It's better to pick a straight section of road after a turn but well before the next turn.
  • ^^Thanks for the clarification. From designing countless routes in mapsource, it's always been recommended to place via's (shaping points) at intersections. This way, devices such as the zumo (and nuvi 7x5 with TW firmware), treat it as a shaping point, and hide the flags associated with them. Are you saying that an intersection point may be insufficient to trigger the end of the segment? Any thoughts on the radius required to trigger detection of end of segment?

    Just looking at my last road trip to MN, ~540mi 35 points, of which 4 area actual way points (POI's). Return leg was close to 50.
  • An intersection point should be sufficient to trigger the end of the segment, but I haven't done enough testing to confirm. I normally don't put a via at an intersection and instead put it on a straight path of road.

    The downside of an intersection point is that there is a possibility the next segment involves making a turn at that intersection, but you won't know it because you have to pass the intersection in order to trigger completion of the current segment.
  • ^^That's what I was thinking too (post several posts back). On occasion, i'll modify the route along the way and maybe delete a few segments. It's nice to be able to see the whole route at a glance by just going to the overview view. With this device, you need to go back to trip planner, reselect it, then you can see the whole thing.

    Walmart has a refurb 3790 for under 2 bills. Think I'll order it and compare. The traffic functions of the 3590 are nice, but I have my smart phone for real up to date traffic.
  • Boyd 1311 Points
    The 3790 has the trip planner, just like the 3590. You will have all the same issues. In fact, the 1695 and 37x0 were the first devices to include the trip planner. Initially there was no capability to import routes at all. After many complaints, garmin added import to a firmware update about a year after the 3790 was introduced. The 1695 never got this upgrade and still can't import routes.
  • After trying to actually drive a basic trip,I find trip planner a joke. It was a relatively short (12 mile), noncircular route. I had several via's on intersections, and several just along the roadway before I was supposed to turn.

    Reaching the via at the intersection, the device did not automatically guide to the next defined point. It seems it missed the fact that I actually arrived at the intersection and was trying to guide me back to it.

    Restarted the trip and selected the next point. That seemed to go pretty well. This point was on in the interstate. After passing it, the next point involved getting off on a cloverleaf offramp and proceeding about 1/4 mile. Upon nearing the offramp, the device didn't say to get off at exit so and so. Instead it was navigate offroad. Very strange.

    I did eventually end up at my destination (this was a route i've done a number of times in the past). Had I been in an unfamiliar area, the results of been a mess.

    This is simply unacceptable.

    I recall reading a thread either on here, gpspassion, or possibly elsewhere that the trip planner on the 37xx series is really more like the routes function of the older unit (in terms of importing and processing gpx files) than that of the newer 35xx/34xx series. This thread suggests otherwise - http://forums.gpsreview.net/discussion/25458/x/p1/ . Any one actually use a 37xx and an older unit with routes can confirm or deny this?
  • Boyd 1311 Points
    I have a 3790 and a variety of other Garmin units. As far as I know, the trip planner is the trip planner. If you want "real" routes, I don't think you'll ever be happy with it - regardless of which model you choose.
  • Boyd, on the topic of trip planner; Lets say you've deviated from the route and now need to pick it back up. With the old routes, I could do an overview view and get back to the route to resume. I assume this overview function still works with TP, but when you actually get there and hit go, how do you know which segment to actually select? That is, if you're in a familiar area it's relatively obvious, but if not, the street names don't have a whole lot of meaning.
  • Boyd 1311 Points
    Honestly, I am not much of a fan of route planning although I have done it occasionally. Mostly, I just like to get in the car and drive. I have used the classic routes on several other devices, including the Montana. I tried the tip planner and the 3790 a couple times and didn't like it.

    Sorry, I don't know the answer to your question.
  • popej 52 Points
    when you actually get there and hit go, how do you know which segment to actually select?
    Trip is not a route. It consist of destinations not VIAs. Since you set destinations, you are supposed to know, where are you going next.

    If you bought nuvi as a device which supports up to 100 routes, then you were deceived. I know the feeling.
  • This experience has prompted me to write a semi lengthy letter to garmin's marketing dept expressing my displeasure with their 1 step forward 10 step back ideology. I just couldn't believe such a snafu was possible. The 3590 is going back in a few days. Meanwhile, I'll try to find a local source for a 14xx to play with before buying one.

    FWIW, I did have some success eliminating all the flags using PONI killer. The issue still remains however that if there's any deviation from the route, it is impossible to get back on without restarting at the beginning.

    Maybe 2013 will bring back some of these removed features :)
  • "Mostly, I just like to get in the car and drive."
    That's me, too.

    I recently wished to go to a destination via a certain town. I googled an address on the main street - on which I knew I would be driving - and put that address as a via/destination (I'm not really sure of the correct word for it.)
    The device announced that I had arrived at my "destination" (that street address) - and continued, without interruption or delay - to guide me to my "real" destination.

    So perhaps that is a more foolproof way of attacking the issue.
  • "I have not yet noticed if more than one alternate is provided."
    I sometimes get 2 alternatives - meaning 3 routes - from which to choose.
  • Got a reply from Garmin who suggest I post a suggestion in through their ideas venue.

    http://www8.garmin.com/contactUs/ideas/

    I've already submitted my comments through that. I suggest others add their feedback as well. Perhaps if enough people complain about lack of Routes, maybe they'll add it into a future device.
  • After trying to actually drive a basic trip,I find trip planner a joke. It was a relatively short (12 mile), noncircular route. I had several via's on intersections, and several just along the roadway before I was supposed to turn.

    Reaching the via at the intersection, the device did not automatically guide to the next defined point. It seems it missed the fact that I actually arrived at the intersection and was trying to guide me back to it.

    Restarted the trip and selected the next point. That seemed to go pretty well. This point was on in the interstate. After passing it, the next point involved getting off on a cloverleaf offramp and proceeding about 1/4 mile. Upon nearing the offramp, the device didn't say to get off at exit so and so. Instead it was navigate offroad. Very strange.

    I did eventually end up at my destination (this was a route i've done a number of times in the past). Had I been in an unfamiliar area, the results of been a mess.

    This is simply unacceptable.

    I recall reading a thread either on here, gpspassion, or possibly elsewhere that the trip planner on the 37xx series is really more like the routes function of the older unit (in terms of importing and processing gpx files) than that of the newer 35xx/34xx series. This thread suggests otherwise - http://forums.gpsreview.net/discussion/25458/x/p1/ . Any one actually use a 37xx and an older unit with routes can confirm or deny this?
    I have the 3790 and the behavior that you describe is what I got when the unit was new. After something life 5 firmware updates and a year later, Garmin attended to Trip Planner such that it would smoothly move from one segment to the next without intervention.

    My question is, is your firmware up to date?
  • gpz1100 0 Points
    ^^No clue. I have long since returned the unit. Picked up a 1490 which did what I needed it to do, properly, at that time.
  • Mundo 0 Points
    nuvifan, Thanks for your review. I notice you included "During two Red Traffic Alerts, I was offered an option for Detour:".
    On a few review sites they said that one drawback was that the unit re-routed during traffic without giving any option.
    Can you confirm if you are given the choice to "re-route" or "stay on existing route" in the event of a traffic notification?

    I'm looking at this unit that seems to have nearly everything I need, but now the 2013 models are here I wondering if I should get the 2597 instead.
  • nuvifan, Thanks for your review. I notice you included "During two Red Traffic Alerts, I was offered an option for Detour:".
    On a few review sites they said that one drawback was that the unit re-routed during traffic without giving any option.
    Can you confirm if you are given the choice to "re-route" or "stay on existing route" in the event of a traffic notification?

    I'm looking at this unit that seems to have nearly everything I need, but now the 2013 models are here I wondering if I should get the 2597 instead.
    Yes I'm curious about that too. The manual isn't clear of course but it suggests that it will reroute without asking first.
  • Now that I've had the unit for a day and have been able to look at the actual menu options it appears that, as with my older 3790, the first step is to set the Avoidance. Things like toll highways, ferries, carpool lanes can be set to be avoided in routing. Traffic is also an option and clicking that avoidance will cause the unit to automatically avoid traffic.

    I would not want to do that. I'm expecting that when the traffic icon turns yellow or red, then the unit can be asked to suggest routes around the traffic. That is as I'd hope.

    However there is the drawback that with a multi stop "Trip" the location of a stop really is often only there to direct the route the preferred way and is not really a necessary stop. This will confound the ability of the unit to truly avoid bad traffic.

    Of course, a well written user manual would describe this but Garmin is notorious for having crap user manuals. Even just knowing that Traffic remained as one of the options for avoidance would have helped to make this more clear. But of course the manual doesn't even list the item in the Avoidance menu.

    I've yet to have a chance to try the unit in traffic situations to see how it performs. I mostly work at home but Mondays are the day I try to go to the office and I expect traffic then!

    I'll also have a chance to confirm that it will follow a multi-stop "trip" much as the 3790 does now that the bugs are out of that unit.

    Baring a serious problem with traffic functions and the "Trip Planner", overall I'd say that I like the 3590 better than the 3790 mainly for the layout of the menus.

    It gets a sat lock much faster. The Voice Command is far better. While the options appear to be mostly the same, it simply listens to me and understands me much better than the 3790 could.

    The Address search is a step back. It really should let one specify the state and city explicitly.

    One question for Garmin: Why have the gotten rid of "Favorites" and now call them "Saved Places". Is that change for the sake of change?
  • Mundo 0 Points
    Hi Crazyfingers, thanks for your confirmation of the traffic avoidance options.
    Keen to hear what you think of it after your Monday commute.

    I'm interested to know why you went for the 3590 instead of one of the 2013 models like the 2597 that seems to have the same functions and very similar 'street' price.
  • Boyd 1311 Points
    The discussion has been fragmented across several threads, but here's the answer. :) http://forums.gpsreview.net/discussion/comment/188421/
    Lack of these Dashboards in the 3597 is a "deal breaker" for me. I think I'm about to order a 3590.
    This is also the reason why I didn't get a 3597 (not to mention a significant price difference). http://forums.gpsreview.net/discussion/26442/x/p1/
  • t923347 203 Points
    Can't speak for crazyfingers but the reason for me would be the screen and the resolution.

    The 3590 has:

    Display resolution, WxH 800 x 480 pixels
    Display type multi-touch, glass, dual-orientation, WVGA color TFT with white backlight

    While the 2597 uses:

    Display resolution, WxH 480 x 272 pixels
    Display type manual dual-orientation, WQVGA color TFT with white backlight

    The difference in resolution as well as the multi touch glass screen is a really big difference IMHO.
  • Hi Crazyfingers, thanks for your confirmation of the traffic avoidance options.
    Keen to hear what you think of it after your Monday commute.

    I'm interested to know why you went for the 3590 instead of one of the 2013 models like the 2597 that seems to have the same functions and very similar 'street' price.
    The new models do not have the Dashboard options to pick how many data fields to show. Speed, time, ETA arrival, Miles to arrival. I require at least 4 data fields when navigating to a place (ETA Destination, Time to Destination, Current time and speed) and the new 2013 models will only show 2 fields. It's a fatal and unforgivable flaw in the 2013 models or at least the 3597 model.
  • t923347 203 Points
    Unless it's a typing error, Mundo asked about a 2597, and not a 3597. :wink:
  • Boyd 1311 Points
    Ha, yes now I see that. I would agree with you there, the 2597 is no match for either the 3590 or 3597. Completely different class of a device with an inferior screen, no "real" 3d view, no multi-touch gestures.

    That doesn't make it bad choice for many people however - it is certainly a good value and will get you to your destination.
  • One idea I had that I was hoping would work does not work on the 3590.

    There is a main road that I use quite a lot to get to various places the other side of town. While being a main road it has a crazy low speed limit of 25 MPH that absolutely no one follows because it's obviously nuts for that road. 40-45 MPH would be much more reasonable for that road. Crazy. Anyway, the maps do have the 25 MPH speed limit for that road and navigation is clearly taking that into account when setting a route. The unit is probably doing what it should do when it doesn't route me down that road, which I always ignore and take that road anyway.

    I was hoping that the 3590's ability to edit speed limits would fix that. I set the speed limit for the whole length of that road to 55 MPH and I set the speed limit for the road that it normally chooses instead as 15 MPH.

    However when routing, changes to the speed limit do not appear to connect when the unit makes routing decisions. That's unfortunate. There are several other roads I would like to "Fix" so that the unit will choose them.
  • Boyd 1311 Points
    Just a guess... but I'll bet those speed limits are just for our own reference (ie: what is displayed on the screen). In the past, the Nuvi has based arrival time calculations on the road *class*. It then refines them based on your speed history for that whole class. For example, secondary roads might typically have a posted limit of 45 mph but you might tend to drive 50. Over time, that would be taken into account.

    However, the same class road can exist in the city, in the suburbs and in the country. Conditions in these places could vary a lot, so an average speed for a road class might not be very meaningful.

    Now trafficTrends is supposed to use historical road data in its calculations and MyTrends is supposed to use your own data. Do you have both of them enabled? IMO, they don't work well so I don't use them. You must be travelling to a destination that's a favorite for myTrends to work.
  • Just a guess... but I'll be those speed limits are just for our own reference (ie: what is displayed on the screen). In the past, the Nuvi has based arrival time calculations on the road *class*. It then refines them based on your speed history for that whole class. For example, secondary roads might typically have a posted limit of 45 mph but you might tend to drive 50. Over time, that would be taken into account.

    However, the same class road can exist in the city, in the suburbs and in the country. Conditions in these places could vary a lot, so an average speed for a road class might not be very meaningful.

    Until a couple years ago I had a very long daily commute to Philadelphia. After retiring, I tend to stay in my own very rural area most of the time and don't drive as fast because I'm just not in a hurry. I have noticed that this affects arrival time estimates.
    Probably true. However it's odd that in my example the Garmin is clearly choosing a slow residential road (thin gray line on the map) instead of a clear commuter road (wider solid yellow line on the map with an insignificant length difference) where the only thing that I could see to cause it to make the wrong choice was the unrealistically slow speed limit on the commuter road.

    Now trafficTrends is supposed to use historical road data in its calculations and MyTrends is supposed to use your own data. Do you have both of them enabled? IMO, they don't work well so I don't use them. You must be travelling to a destination that's a favorite for myTrends to work.
    I turned them most of the time with the old 3790. I didn't see it making any getter choices over time based on the actual route I took. I had it on probably 200 times while using the road that the Nuvi wanted me to avoid. Didn't make any difference in its routing choices.

    It did sometimes correctly guess where I was going based on my previous trips to the same place at the same time but it would also frequently guess totally wrong.

    For the 3590 I don't know if they have made improvements to trafficTrends and MyTrends but they are on. However I've only had the thing for a couple days and have only taken a couple of short drives - mainly up that road to see if changing the speed limits would change the routing choices. As it builds up some history maybe I'll see a difference if they have improved the function.

    Garmin makes odd choices on these features. With the 3790 I have noticed for example that on the Monday when I start off for the office it will sometimes guess that I am in fact going to the office and in that case when I click it, it will show the route that I always take. But when I start off telling it that I'm going to the office, it ignores all that history and routes me a way that I never take.

    I would have thought that it could learn that when if I go from home to a favorite the same way all the time, that's the way I want to go when I tell it that's what I'm doing. At least that's what I thought that myTrends would eventually learn when I originally got the 3790.

    Maybe the 3590 is different but I doubt it.
  • Boyd 1311 Points
    However it's odd that in my example the Garmin is clearly choosing a slow residential road (thin gray line on the map) instead of a clear commuter road
    This is the kind of thing I saw all the time with TrafficTrends enabled. It would send me on ridiculous routes using small streets. Especially goofy in Philadelphia where it would route me on narrow side streets through questionable neighborhoods, saving no time when the obvious direct route on the main road was much better.
    ______

    Played around with the Dezl 760 in Automotive mode this morning at Best Buy and I thought it was pretty cool actually. Virtually identical to the 3590 except for the obvious hardware difference (7" resistive screen). It has dashboards and the same 3d map browser as the 3xxx devices, but no 3d terrain and no multi-touch gestures. Also no portrait view. Response seemed about the same as my 3550 so I'd guess the CPU is the same.

    Also played with a 3597 and just didn't feel the love. Hardware didn't seem any faster than the 3590. The magnetic mount is a yawn for me and lack of dashboard support is a turn-off too.
  • However it's odd that in my example the Garmin is clearly choosing a slow residential road (thin gray line on the map) instead of a clear commuter road


    This is the kind of thing I saw all the time with TrafficTrends enabled. It would send me on ridiculous routes using small streets. Especially goofy in Philadelphia where it would route me on narrow side streets through questionable neighborhoods, saving no time when the obvious direct route on the main road was much better.
    Even when "Faster time" is selected, the side street is not a shorter drive and there is never any traffic problem on the road I want.

    The 3790 didn't do really obvious stupid things to me much when I was away from areas that I was familiar with anyway ... that I noticed. But there are persistent bad choices that it makes over and over in my local area.

    I was hoping the 3590 would lose those bad choices.
  • sussamb 179 Points
    Just bear in mind we 'know' our local area so also know which is the fastest/shortest/traffic free route etc. When we're in an unfamiliar area we often don't realise if our GPS makes routing errors. I doubt it's acting any different ... we just think it is :wink:
  • crazyfingers 41 Points
    edited July 2013
    Just bear in mind we 'know' our local area so also know which is the fastest/shortest/traffic free route etc. When we're in an unfamiliar area we often don't realise if our GPS makes routing errors. I doubt it's acting any different ... we just think it is :wink:
    Well, ya.. that's why I added "... that I noticed." :)
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