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Base Camp a lesson in frustration

I purchased a garmin 3590lmt last year in the hopes of creating all these custom maps to really impress my motorcycle friends with all the great rides I have created. Why is it so difficult to use this software! I've yet to create a custom map I can use, I'm down to writing my directions by hand which is much easier. I just wish google would allow you turn by turn directions with custom maps, it would be is so much easier to use then this base camp.

(moderator note @lac111254 - thread has been moved to the Garmin Automotive Forum)

Comments

  • Boyd 1960 Points
    edited April 2014
    Do you mean custom routes? This is what Garmin considers" custom maps": http://www.garmin.com/us/products/onthetrail/custommaps
  • Hi Boyd, I have been trying to create a custom route that I can follow with my Garmin. I like take motorcycle rides with friends and we are always looking for great roads to ride on. I knew Garmin had the capability of creating custom routes and that was the reason I purchased it. Well I'm very disappointed with the software, I have not been able to create even one custom route it is not user friendly. I'm now back to planning my route on google maps and writing it down.
  • alanb 529 Points
    You can create a multipoint route in Mapquest and transfer it to your nuvi.
  • sussamb 786 Points
    I have not been able to create even one custom route it is not user friendly.
    I use Basecamp almost every day to create routes both for my nuvis and handhelds, and have no problems with it. Perhaps you could explain the issues you're having so we can help?

    You might also like to look at http://www8.garmin.com/learningcenter/training/basecamp/

  • privet01 195 Points
    There are internet sites that you can create routes on then export them manually to your gps. Many are more friendlier than basecamp. You just need to experiment with them and learn the slight differences of all the different types of routes you can create. Some will get recalculated based on the map you have on your device others may not.
  • menhir 112 Points
    edited April 2014
    I think the problem may be generically stated...because it's the same problem I had with Basecamp...

    For those of us who don't create maps everyday, the learning curve and complexity of the program - the ability to get it to do simple things in a simple manner - is so steep that it's utility for the occasional (like moi) user is diminished to the point where it's more frustrating to use than effective.

    It reminds me of Linux. Since XP is no longer supported, I converted two of my old business computers to Linux based on all the glowing reviews of all the things it can do. I lost so much time even trying to get simple things, like even getting the printers to work, that the loss of productivity wasn't worth the effort.

    One of the converted computers now sits in the corner running Seti@home, so not all was lost. :-) I haven't given up, rather I've relegated it to the "I'll work on it when I have the time" shelf until I get it to work or decide on another alternative.

    Still, not a rant. Just a statement. I appreciate all the help I get from people on this forum and, unlike a lot of communities, it's help politely given.
  • sussamb 786 Points
    Well let's not prejudge what problems lac111254 is having :-)

    Like very many programs lack of use can mean having problems when you come to try to use it, but really it's not that complicated, and is now with some of the latest updates a vey capable program. If all you want to do is create routes it's no more difficult, in fact I would say it's easier, than creating routes in Mapquest or Google Maps.
  • menhir 112 Points
    edited April 2014
    That's what I've been doing. It's their limited ability to transfer the routes to my device that's lacking. I understand the Mapquest can transfer routes to the GPS, and I've gone and created a test route for the purpose of trying it out in what I laughingly call "real life." Up until recently, it's been too darn cold to try it out, though. At least on my motorcycle. :-)

    I'll guess now that it's warmer, I'll try it out on one of my upcoming trips.


  • Well I agree with the complexity of BC. I found that if I wanted a motorcycle route I have to set it to automobile. Just clicking say 5 points and saving the route, you can't continue the same route you have to add to it and it creates another router. Erasing and trying to move a path is impossible. MS Streets and Trips does this much better.
  • sussamb 786 Points
    You can extend a route. Just hover the insert tool over the last point until you see a dark circle, then click and away you go.

    Not sure what you mean by 'erasing and trying to move a path'? Do you mean 'rubber banding' a route? Just use the insert tool. 4.3 (which is in beta at the moment) makes it even easier as you can also 'rubber band' using Alt + the pan tool, or right click and select 'Insert waypoint'.
  • Well that just creates some goofball loop around and will not just go in a straight line.
    Can't find any good help on this.
  • OK started a new route and that appears to work. Didn't on my saved route.
  • Okay. I signed up on this forum because I thought I must be some kind of dummy as I couldn't get Base Camp to do ANYTHING that I thought was the reason I bought the Garmin GPS for. I did the video tutorial and it was totally inaccurate. I know this because I got frustrated and tried their live support phone line. Even the tech had to research her material for an explanation and the way that she had me set up a route was definitely different than the tutorial. And, I wished that I had made written notes as we walked thru it because it was so complex that I can't duplicate the process.
    Like what I'm hearing from some of the other contributors, BaseCamp is just an exercise in futility. Its much too complicated for the occasional user to be able to navigate.
    There. At least I got a little of it off my chest. Thanks for allowing the rant.
  • First of all I would like to thank everyone for their valuable input. Last Sunday I was able to setup a motorcycle route and transfer it to my garmin 3590 and follow it with some success. I had trouble with the route at the very beginning, fortunately I new the route so I continued on without the purple direction guide. Eventually it picked up the route I had created and ended with a successful ride. This is what I discovered when creating the route, I tried to rubber band too far down the route which causes the purple guide to leave the road, for example if I zoomed out I saw the purple guide to the left of the road I wanted to follow, you have to really zoom in and not go too
    far down the road small increments work best but time consuming also watch what side the road your on especially divided Highway it will send you in the other direction. I have duel monitors so what I did was open Google maps on the second screen to aid in the navigation since I was zoomed in on base camp map.
    I will continue to experiment and share what I find.
    To all thanks again
  • sussamb 786 Points
    edited April 2014
    Worth persevering. I use Basecamp pretty much exclusively for route planning and it can be made to do exactly what you want. Even better is that the 2013 on nuvis accept shaping/do not alert points from Basecamp.

    v4.3 is in beta at the moment and has some considerable enhancements over v4.2. These include an address search more like the old Mapsource, route optimization and better use of categories.
  • sussamb 786 Points
    OK started a new route and that appears to work. Didn't on my saved route.
    Works on saved routes also.

  • sussamb 786 Points
    edited April 2014
    Just need to qualify that, in case I misunderstood what you meant by 'saved' routes. You can edit saved routes in Basecamp. You can't edit routes saved on a nuvi, zumo or dezl ... but that's a device issue, not Basecamp. Basecamp can edit routes saved to handheld devices as they work differently.
  • sussamb 786 Points
    edited April 2014
    I signed up on this forum because I thought I must be some kind of dummy as I couldn't get Base Camp to do ANYTHING that I thought was the reason I bought the Garmin GPS for. I did the video tutorial and it was totally inaccurate.
    Yes, the videos are a tad out of date as they're not keeping up with the pace of BC development. Yo should use them as a guide not an exact science. Pressing the F1 function key or using Help in the top toolbar is a better way to learn Basecamp.

    If you raise queries here then you'll get the help you need, once you learn the basics BC is actually very simple (must be because I can use it).

    The best thing to do if you haven't already is to turn on a lot of the toolbars that aren't visible by default. Go to View, Toolbars and ensure Detail Level, Drawing Tools, Map Products and Map Tools are selected.

  • truckinguy 115 Points
    I'm still in the club of Base Camp fustration. It still is much harder for me to use then MS. I hope the category work in BC will be similar to MS categories. Odd you can make them in the Nuvi but can't transfer them to basecamp as such like in MS and in the properties of favorites it doesn't snow which category it's in.
    Maybe I've had too many years working with MS. 18 yrs to be exact.
  • sussamb 786 Points
    edited April 2014
    I think that's the biggest issue, if you've spent a lot of time on Mapsource then Basecamp is very different. At one stage categories did transfer to Basecamp as lists, and Basecamp lists became categories. That was removed a while back as it caused too much confusion for some users.

    In 4.3 categories work more like the Mapsource categories did.

    Should anyone wish to try the beta, or indeed contribute, it's available here

    https://forums.garmin.com/showthread.php?82163-BaseCamp-4-3-0-3-BETA-is-Now-Available

    Note though that from 4.3 onwards BC will not work with Win XP as Microsoft have ended support for XP.
  • OK started a new route and that appears to work. Didn't on my saved route.


    Works on saved routes also.

    I just started over and had to figure out how it all worked. The big secret was hovering the mouse over where I wanted to start again. I guess I didn't do it long enough. Moving points works well. I am planning a 3000 mile trip and this is my first use of a GPS to help. I have always used the MAP technique which never failed. ;-)
  • menhir 112 Points
    BC will not work with Win XP as Microsoft have ended support for XP
    And because of that, as a business user, I ended my support for Microsoft and am now running my business on Linux. :-)

    I don't know if there's a Linux version of MS or BC, probably not, but I still have my home computer running Windows 7, so I'm still in the routing game.
  • Boyd 1960 Points
    edited April 2014
    Basecamp has run on Windows XP since the very beginning (http://garmin.blogs.com/pr/2009/01/introducing-basecamp-garmins-new-tool-for-planning-and-reviewing-all-of-your-outdoor-adventures.html)

    You can continue to run the current version, you just won't be able to upgrade to new versions. And you can continue to use Mapsource on XP but Garmin won't provide technical support for it.

    They never introduced Linux versions of either program. But they offered an early Mac program called RoadTrip which was somewhere between Mapsource and Basecamp. This was at a time when no other major company had Mac support.

    I have been a Mac user since the very beginning, and when I got my first GPS there was nobody that supported it. I used a hand-me-down Windows 95 PC my business was throwing away to run Mapsource. :)

    Today I have a Mac and a Windows machine because I make my own maps and the best software for that just doesn't exist on either Linux or MacOSX.
  • truckinguy 115 Points
    I think that's the biggest issue, if you've spent a lot of time on Mapsource then Basecamp is very different. At one stage categories did transfer to Basecamp as lists, and Basecamp lists became categories. That was removed a while back as it caused too much confusion for some users.

    In 4.3 categories work more like the Mapsource categories did.

    .

    I tried Beta this morning. So far it's not looking good category wise. I loaded my favorites list which in MS shows all my favorites broken down into categories of course. But no were in Basecamp can I find a list of such or menu to find them. Only in the properties of the favorite you can see a tab now for category. But it doesn't recognize MS's categories. I can create one but after that it doesn't have a menu any were to find the favorites in that category.
    Odd that we can transfer back and forth the favorites and their assigned categories between Nuvi and MS but Basecamp just can't see them. Even now. So in what form are they given us this new category option? Maybe if I create one in the "category" tab in favorite property it will transfer to the nuvi. But this isn't looking good.

  • sussamb 786 Points
    Mine transfer back and forth between my nuvis and Basecamp with no issues. Not sure what happens if you try from Mapsource as haven't used it for at least a year. The intention is to provide a search/filter capability in due course.
  • solarbill 0 Points
    Okay. I came back to this discussion to see if there was something I was missing or if I'd read something that would finally turn the lights on for me.
    I've continued to try BaseCamp to set up routes that I wanted to follow and still can not get anywhere with it. It is simply too complicated for a novice to use.
    On a couple of occasions, I have coaxed my wife into using our Garmin so she wouldn't get lost going to our granddaughters house. (Going from Lake Alfred FL to Palm Harbor FL) Both times, the Garmin has directed her thru a very shady section of Tampa and I am not comfortable with her being in high crime areas. So I tried setting up a "route" that would take her on the BEST and least timely way. All I get from my attempts is frustration. I'm ready to delete BaseCamp from my computer and just draw my wife a paper map.
    And .... NO ... the f1 key doesn't help.
  • sussamb 786 Points
    edited May 2014
    It really isn't that hard to create a route and send it to your GPS. Can you explain what you're trying to do so maybe we can see where you're going wrong?

    Perhaps this might help you understand

  • alanb 529 Points
    @solarbill ... You might want to give Mapquest a try for route creation and transfer to your nuvi. Some people find Mapquest a little more intuitive than Basecamp. Here is a post I made a while back explaining how to create and transfer a route with Mapquest: http://forums.gpsreview.net/discussion/comment/194185#Comment_194185

    I am assuming your nuvi model is one that supports routing. What model nuvi do you have?
  • t923347 424 Points
    I agree that Mapquest is a lot easier to use than Basecamp or Mapsource. It may not be as integrated into Garmin devices but for creating routes and easily transferring them to the Nuvi you can't beat it.

    One note of caution. To transfer the created route from Mapquest to the Nuvi you need to use the SEND button on the Mapquest map screen. Try as I might I can't get that button to appear when using Firefox (even the newest version v.29). The Send button appears when you use IE or Chrome however.
  • lac111254 0 Points
    I have successfully uploaded a map to my Garmin 3590lmt however it isn't easy to use and difficult to create, it requires patients.   The problem is you cannot select a route for a long distance without it moving to its own route but when you select in small increments it creates multiple trips, I cannot figure out how to make it one single route after I finish.
    When you follow a route configured this way I have to wait while the next destination appears which is very distracting when riding a motorcycle.
  • lac111254 0 Points
    I will have try mapquest to see if it is easier to use.
  • sussamb 786 Points
    Afraid that's the way the 3590 works, as it uses the older style trip planner.
  • solarbill 0 Points
    I saw the post about HOW you lay in a route on MapQuest and followed it .. right down to saving it to my Nuvi. It took me a while but I did find the map once it was in the Nuvi under the Apps icon. Now to put it to the test. Saturday, I'll be leaving on a trip and I've planned the first part of that trip according to what I laid out in MapQuest.
  • sussamb 786 Points
    Routes created in either basecamp or Mapquest are converted to trips in those nuvis that use trip planner. As you've discovered they appear in Apps, Trip Planner.

    You still haven't said (or I've missed it) which model nuvi you have. You should be able to view the trip in Basecamp to verify it goes the way you want, or look at it on the nuvi itself. Either should give you confidence that it'll work :-)
  • karlbu 0 Points
    edited January 2015
    I just converted from MapSource to BaseCamp. I was thrilled to learn that Garmin created new mapping software to address problems with MapSource.

    Oops. Wrong. Same old clunky, non-intuitive, how the hell to I do this, interface. Come on Garmin, the 'help' instructions for performing certain tasks don't even work.

    Found this thread, and just had to laugh.

    The answer is that Garmin is a hardware company. They don't get software—as evidenced by the new and improved (laugh) BaseCamp. The software is written by engineers, for engineers—and apparently with virtually no usability testing.

    I just created a reverse route (no, I'm sorry; not 'reverse.' It's 'inverse') in BaseCamp. It can't even do a basic function like that without adding a dozen new waypoints to the original route, and totally mucking up the process with extraneous loops, irrelevant zig zags, and side trips.

    What a disaster. Garmin: The emperor has no clothes! BaseCamp is really bad software. Seriously, it's terrible, defined as: clunky, non-intuitive, and impossible to figure out.

    Hire some software engineers and give them the authority to fix BaseCamp.

    Cheers.
  • sussamb 786 Points
    If you've just converted you probably haven't learnt how Basecamp works properly yet. I've been using it for a while now and it'll do everything I need it to. I use it with all 5 of my Garmin GPS.
  • Boyd 1960 Points
    "Come on Garmin"

    "Garmin: The emperor has no clothes!"

    "Garmin" isn't here, this is a user-to-user forum. You can interact directly with the software developers in Garmin's own forum: https://forums.garmin.com/forumdisplay.php?179-BaseCamp
  • karlbu 0 Points
    Understand. But Garmin product managers likely monitor public forums.
  • sussamb 786 Points
    I doubt it, they're probably busy enough without monitoring every public forum.
  • Tim 1470 Points
    Garmin does monitor these forums, several days per week. With that said a general complaint posted here isn't likely cause them to take any action. Feedback sent directly to them, through the link Boyd linked to above, is the best way to get their attention.
  • menhir 112 Points
    Actually, I've deleted Basecamp from my computer. I was just settling down to a winter rest with the intention of tackling the program - again - when I thought to myself, "Why am I wasting any more time on this?"

    Not being a daily user, the learning/relearning process I went through every time I wanted to use it was just not worth the effort. Not whining or pouting....Just moving on.

    I'm still keeping MapSource though. :P
    I was able to make and transfer routes made on MapSource within hours of first using it. It'll do.
  • sussamb 786 Points
    If MapSource works for you then why not. It'll even work with the newer nuvis but they require to be set to mass storage and not mtp mode for Mapsource to see them.
  • GJT 0 Points
    I am experiencing the same problems. New device - delivered today.
    The obvious options would, surely, be:- to click on one point to start and another to end (then modify) OR to start, click on a series of points to select the route then END Route. But when doing the latter, no end point is available.
    And it is SLOW! I'm running on an i7 machine and have a Zumo plugged in.

    Furthermore, if I have "motorbike" selected why is 90% of a route on a motorway.
    X_X
  • GJT 0 Points
    And it is SO SLOW in calculation! I don't understand why it takes minutes to calculate a route of 120 miles when Google Maps does it in a second.

    Thank you to Sussamb for the helpful guide which is significantly better than the Garmin ones (especially as it has no dreadful music, just guidance). However, you need to plan routes longer than can be shown at acceptable detail so scrolling around is essential.
  • sussamb 786 Points
    GJT said:

    The obvious options would, surely, be:- to click on one point to start and another to end (then modify) OR to start, click on a series of points to select the route then END Route.

    Sure you can end it. Once you've completed the route just select another tool and the route tool will stop working.

  • sussamb 786 Points
    GJT said:


    Furthermore, if I have "motorbike" selected why is 90% of a route on a motorway.
    X_X

    Why shouldn't it be? Motorbikes are allowed on motorways. If you don't want that try adjusting the routing avoidances in whichever profile you're using (there are things there like 'avoid highways')

  • sussamb 786 Points
    GJT said:

    And it is SO SLOW in calculation! I don't understand why it takes minutes to calculate a route of 120 miles when Google Maps does it in a second.

    So does my BaseCamp, it certainly shouldn't be taking minutes. Or are you talking about on the device itself? Even then while it's not as quick as Google (who have massive processing power compared to a stand alone GPS) routes on my devices take 3 to 4 seconds on average.

  • Peckster 0 Points
    sussamb said:

    You can extend a route. Just hover the insert tool over the last point until you see a dark circle, then click and away you go.

    Not sure what you mean by 'erasing and trying to move a path'? Do you mean 'rubber banding' a route? Just use the insert tool. 4.3 (which is in beta at the moment) makes it even easier as you can also 'rubber band' using Alt + the pan tool, or right click and select 'Insert waypoint'.

    I have basecamp on my lap top and on my Mac. Why is there no insert tool on the Mac when there is on the lap top? The Mac has a much bigger screen so much easier to enter a route but there is no Insert, erase move point or divide tools on the Mac. I checked and it is up to date.
  • sussamb 786 Points
    As a PC user I can't be sure but on the PC version this can happen if you haven't selected the appropriate toolbar, perhaps it's the same on a Mac?
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