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Does it still make sense in 2016 to buy a Garmin?

2

Comments

  • Chris_Sav 58 Points
    3790T was creaking so badly I have taken the plunge and ordered an DriveLuxe 50LMT-D EU from Halfords today. No smartphone for me.
  • sussamb 664 Points
    Would be good to hear your experiences with this :)
  • Chris_Sav 58 Points
    Hopefully Halfords will offer me a new one this time not, as last time, one that had been out on trial with South Wales Police who had not wiped the tracks.

    Will check internal memory for the promised 16gig.

    Surprised me Halfords have it when it's not on offer on the Garmin site yet.
  • alanb 374 Points
    The NA DriveLuxe and DriveAssist models do not seem to be available in the US yet. Some online sites are listing April 12 as the availability date.
  • Boyd 1792 Points
    After playing around for a bit, I found a way to move my most important Nuvi favorites into the iPhone Garmin StreetPilot app. It's a bit complicated, so I started a new thread in the SmartPhone forum: http://forums.gpsreview.net/discussion/30277/getting-favorites-from-your-nuvi-into-the-garmin-streetpilot-app
  • jessejazza 1 Point
    edited April 2016
    t923347 said:

    Been a big Nuvi fan since 2005 but I'm finding I use my phone for navigation more and more these days. After using a bunch of applications on my Galaxy S4 (soon to be a S7) I've really come down to 2 that I use almost exclusively now - Google Maps and HERE.......

    I agree with you in some ways. I am a truck driver and cover 1500-2000 miles per week. I have used a Garmin 52LM and like you over the last few months have started to use a smartphone more and more. Phone data use is minimal but almost 50 hours a week would dig a hole. I got a smartphone for google maps when necessary and exploring the various satnav apps available.

    Sadly only two worth using as an offline app (imho) - Here and Navmii. I really liked Here as one could do simple routing with it and work out distances between two points whilst being at another location. Just like google maps - Here is virtually a clone. One can do the same with Navmii but more experimentation needed. Navmii is better for POI and better screen but Here is so pleasing to use.

    A month ago with a Here update it seemed to have bugs and I have ceased using it.

    I use Openstreet maps and found them fine and download end of each month. (I didn't think much of Garmin Express. Bought a micro SDcard, formatted to FAT32, make a directory 'garmin' (needs to be small case) don't see this written anywhere). Navmii I think have only done an update every 3 months. The garmin maps have a bit more detail than the 'diagrammatic' Here or Navmii ones more like TomTom. As for TomTom one can't update maps other than their way and they are not as informative as garmin I have found.

    In summary; I prefer my garmin for every day work but use the phone for quick trips into town. The phone at work is a good essential backup having had the experience of the garmin cable 'dying' - no satnav I am lost!. Google maps has it's place occasionally. So as a 'pro-user' I would still use a satnav but if not pro driving I would stick to a smartphone. So Yes I think for the non 'pro-user' the phone has replaced the satnav but if my garmin 'died' tomorrow I'd get another.

    Worth bearing in mind that one shouldn't come too dependent on a satnav. One tends to lose sense of direction... I use a map for main roads and turn to a satnav for detail.
  • Boyd 1792 Points
    edited April 2016
    Have been using the Garmin StreetPilot Onboard app for about three weeks now, and just returned from a day in New York City, almost 300 mile round trip from my home in Southern New Jersey. The executive summary is that there are good and bad things about the app, but for my own style of use, the good things outweigh the bad so I am sticking with it (although the 3590 will be in the glovebox as a backup).

    I purchased the traffic add-on ($20) and found it to be very accurate yesterday, although there were no serious traffic issues to deal with. I do not have the app set to automatically avoid traffic, I prefer to make that decision myself. There was one problem on the Garden State Parkway where traffic was backed up for a few miles and the app reported this correctly. But it didn't realize that I was in the express lanes (totally separated from the local lanes) and traffic was moving fine there. There were a few slow spots, like the Lincoln Tunnel, and they were shown properly.

    I never used the traffic receiver on the Nuvi, was not impressed. So I don't completely recall the interface. Seems to me that on my model, you actually had to switch to a separate really ugly map to see a traffic display. On the StreetPilot app, traffic is shown on the main map screen using several different color coded road overlays. But these overlay are thin, just like a regular road, not a wide line like the current route. I found it very confusing, and it took me awhile to realize that they were depicting traffic conditions. Now that I know what to look for, it's better but I still think there should be a wider "highlight" of the roads instead of the thin striped display.

    Routing was about what I would expect from the Nuvi in most cases. Exiting the Holland Tunnel, it appeared that the app was not properly tracking my position so I restarted it. This might have been "operator error", since I was distracted by a very charming passenger at the time. ;) But I saw something similar a few days ago driving around near my home, where I ignored a turn the app told me to make, and then it seemed to "play dead" and stopped tracking me (although it did not crash).

    After missing a turn, I found the screen display confusing a few times. There seemed to be "leftovers" of the pink route line mixed with the new route such that it looked like I needed to drive in circles. This only happened a couple times though, and it might have been less of an issue if I had autozoom enabled, since it probably would have zoomed way in to only show the area around my car (I have autozoom turned off).

    For the most part, I think the app is better in New York's "urban canyons" since it can also use cell towers and wifi hotspots for location. It almost always showed me on the correct street, although sometimes it would have me facing the wrong direction when sitting at a stoplight. The Nuvi is worse in these areas, you can watch your position drift by a block or more at times. Did not see any errors this large with the app.

    Going through the Lincoln Tunnel, the car's position was correctly shown as I sped up and slowed down with traffic. The Nuvi shows your position in the tunnel, but that is just a gimmick since it cannot get a GPS fix. It just assumes that you will continue moving at the same speed you were going when entering the tunnel. The app was actually tracking me using cell signals (which are broadcast inside the tunnel).

    I like the junction view feature better on the app. The pictures look nicer on the higher resolution iPhone screen, and they do not stay on the screen as long as the Nuvi. I prefer that; on the Nuvi they stay on screen too long and I prefer to look at the map.

    I also purchased the "urban guidance" upgrade ($5) but had an issue there. I tried 3 times to purchase and each time the app just hung, saying it was completing the purchase, but then nothing happened. I e-mailed Garmin support about this and got an answer within 24 hours. It was just the standard dumb stuff, like "is your phone connected to the internet, have you restarted your phone, etc". I tried again the next day and the purchase went through, so I guess there was an issue with Garmin's servers before.

    Did not use urban guidance on this trip, but I used it extensively on a trip to Europe in 2014 and it worked well, Figured it might be nice to have in the US someday though, so I can use the same favorites I use in the car. There is no pedestrian mode or pedestrian routing in the StreetPilot app unless you purchase this option. It can route you using public transportation, based on the preferences that you set.

    My overall impression is that this could be a real "killer app" if Garmin hadn't intentionally crippled it by removing some features that the Nuvi has - ability to import/export tracks, routes, POI and favorites, ability to add your own maps.

    None of these are deal breakers for me. And even if they were deal breakers for you, there are some pretty good work-arounds for most. You can run another app for things like topo maps and aerial imagery for example. There are plenty of apps that will record your track too. It is easy to switch between apps and I don't see any real performance impact to running several at the same time.

    BTW, the performance of the app is noticeably better than the Nuvi. Routes calculate /re-calculate very quickly. There is no lag in the display even when map detail is set to most and you zoom out to show all the little streets in NYC. That really bogs down my Nuvis. The iPhones higher resolution screen is also a nice plus for showing urban areas with lots of streets. And the iPhone screen is much, much brighter than any of my Nuvis.

    The map version shows as 2016.10, so assuming the numbering matches the Nuvi, that is a year old. No big deal for me, I'm used to old maps. :) The only place I saw an impact was a section of the Garden State Parkway (roughly between mileposts 90 and 100) where the app displayed a 55 MPH speed limit. The real speed limit is 65, however I believe this is very new. They just finished construction on that section of the Parkway, and I think the speed limit was always 55 in the past. Doesn't matter a lot, because everyone is driving over 70 anyway, LOL.

    So I'm happy with the app, and more and more convinced that I won't by another Nuvi (or DriveLuxe or whatever) again in the future.
  • alanb 374 Points
    Thanks for the interesting review Boyd. I wonder if Garmin has any plans to port the StreetPilot app over to Android.
  • Boyd 1792 Points
    Well they have "Garmin Navigator" for Android (as mentioned earlier in this thread). It looks similar to StreetPilot, but not quite the same. For some reason, they have decided not to offer it in North America however. And of course there was "Viago" that ran on both Android and iOS. That was discontinued after being on the market for less than a year.

    https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.garmin.android.obn.client&hl=en

    Garmin® Navigator turns your Android phone into a personal GPS, with features from the nüvi® personal navigators from Garmin, the IFA 2012 “App of the year” winner and leading US provider of personal navigation devices. With no data charges on the Telstra network after downloading the app and no ads, Navigator includes free basic navigation with premium features requiring a subscription or day pass.
  • Boyd 1792 Points
    FWIW, here's what the traffic alerts look like in the app. The second screenshot shows the yellow zone indicating slow traffic. There is also a red version of this for heavy traffic. When combined with the road color and pink route line, this can be a little confusing at first look. I have never seen this style traffic display on the Nuvi; do the newer models also show traffic as the dotted red/yellow overlays?

    image


    image
  • sussamb 664 Points
    edited April 2016
    Yes

    image
  • Boyd 1792 Points
    edited April 2016
    Thanks! That is very similar, but if you look closely it's not quite the same, which is what I mentioned in my earlier post. The pink route line is wider which makes it a little more obvious. In the app, the yellow dots are the same width as the pink line, so there's less of a visual cue where the route goes.

    Garmin probably hasn't updated the app for the new very high resolution phone screens - mine is full HD, 1920x1080. I have several apps where this also seems to be an issue. Perhaps also a map theme issue, will have to try some others.
  • Boyd 1792 Points
    edited April 2016
    Here's something interesting. On the iPhone, all it takes is the tap of a button to wirelessly mirror the screen on an AppleTV using something called "AirPlay". This works nicely on my 46" Sony Bravia HDTV. Was thinking this might be an alternative to using software like Basecamp if you could create routes on a big screen. However, with AirPlay turned on, when I switch to StreetPilot the screen goes black and displays a message to the effect "The map cannot be displayed on an external screen due to license restrictions".

    Ridiculous. My maps in the Galileo app look great on the 46" screen. But Garmin just refuses to let the StreetPilot app live up to its full potential. :O)

    There is an in-app purchase for "Vehicle Display Integration" that will "display a navigation map on an external display installed in some vehicles". Apparently this only works with Kenwood devices, and the in-app purchase is $50 which is kind of crazy. ;)

    https://support.garmin.com/support/searchSupport/case.faces?caseId=%7B774aebc0-a2e7-11e2-65d0-000000000000%7D

  • Boyd 1792 Points
    Oh, and I just noticed this disclaimer. The phone needs to be hardwired to the Kenwood receiver, and they only support the old style iPhone connector (Apple switched to the new connector about 3 years ago). So my phone wouldn't be compatible anyway (not that it matters, since I don't have a Kenwood receiver).
    __________________

    "please note that iPhone 5 or newer devices will not be compatible due to the type of connector"
  • Boyd 1792 Points
    edited April 2016
    Here are a few more screenshots. Have used the app extensively in New York City now, and it is a huge improvement over the Nuvi. It always shows me on the correct street and intersection. Have been through a number of Nuvi models and would say there is only a 50/50 chance of this being right with a dedicated PND.

    Here's an example of Junction View. It is included for free, but you must download the JV file within the app after installation.

    image

    The route overview screen, you can see yellow and red traffic hotspots here. One thing I don't like: whenever you start a route, ALL your favorites are shown on screen and there doesn't seem to be any way to prevent this.

    image

    Going through the tunnel - note the accuracy circle around my position. The size of this circle varies as you drive. Note that it is smaller with the 5 bar cell signal and larger with the 2 bar. The display of your speed is frozen as soon as the (real) gps signal is lost and it does not work again until you re-acquire the satellites. I guess cell phone positioning isn't accurate enough to calculate speed.

    image

    image
  • privet01 145 Points
    Boyd said:

    Here are a few more screenshots........

    Just to be sure, this is the Garmin Street Pilot app you are telling us about........ correct?

  • Boyd 1792 Points
    edited April 2016
    Yes: https://buy.garmin.com/en-US/US/on-the-go/apps/garmin-streetpilot-onboard/prod98479.html

    I have the full North America version. Was tempted to get the Lower 49 which is cheaper, but you cannot upgrade later so I decided to get everything. I also have the Western Europe version. Since you cannot install additional maps, these are completely separate apps that are identical except for the map.
  • privet01 145 Points
    I use an android phone, so I must not be wanted by Garmin. <<grin>>. Either they made a heck of an exclusive deal with Apple, or the bell curve for android users in the US and North America didn't favor us.
  • Boyd 1792 Points
    Well this thread has rambled on for quite a bit, but we have already covered this. To summarize

    1. There is an Android version of the StreetPilot app, but Garmin only offers it in a few select countries

    2. Garmin introduced an app on both iOS and Android called "Viago" that looked exactly like StreetPilot. The basic app was very cheap, and you were nickle-and-dimed to add features until the cost was about the same as StreetPilot. After about a year, Garmin completely discontinued the app.

    3. I think Garmin is terrified that an app will be "too good" and threaten their dedicated device sales.
  • alanb 374 Points
    I think #3 says it all :)
  • Zemartelo 102 Points
    I think garmin is putting their Car navigation line out of business with their pricing.
    With the smartphone gaining ground in mapping products it doesnt make sense anymore to pay 200, 300, 500 bucks for a dedicated GPS device that gets the maps update twice a year and with traffic data unavailable pretty much anywhere outside the big cities.
    They had a good idea with the garmin link app to provide data via the smartphone but not only is not available everywhere as well it costs an yearly fee.

    Waze offers all of it plus I can report in real time traffic obstructions and provide with map updates that are quickly implemented (I can also provide map updates) and its free for me (besides the data costs).

  • alanb 374 Points
    I can understand why Garmin has to charge so much more for their inadequate hardware than smart phones charge for much superior hardware ... no ongoing source of revenue for a dedicated GPS. The people who sell smartphones can take a beating on the hardware because they will make it up on monthly subscription fees. The computer printer manufacturers figured this out a long time ago ... sell the printer at a loss then overcharge for the cartridges.
  • Boyd 1792 Points
    edited May 2016
    alanb said:

    The people who sell smartphones can take a beating on the hardware because they will make it up on monthly subscription fees

    I think them days is over Alan. AFAIK, all the "subsidized" smartphone plans are gone now. Verizon dropped theirs awhile ago, AT&T dropped theirs in January. Now you must pay full price for the phone, but they finance it for 0% over a period of time that you select. For example, I have "AT&T Next 30" so every month I pay 1/30th of the phone purchase price. To sweeten the deal, after 24 months I can turn the phone in and get a new one though, and the cycle starts again.

    I think the Garmin cost difference is probably a lot more basic - economy of scale. I think Apple sells more than 200 million iPhones every year. How many Nuvi's do you think Garmin sells? I would be surpised if it was even one million per year.

    Then there's the upgrade cycle. I think 2 years is pretty common for smartphones. Doubt it was ever that high for the Nuvi. :)
  • libwitch 0 Points
    We use both our phones and our Garmin; and I think if our Garmin was to die anytime soon we would replace it. What we have found is that in a lot of place we drive our smartphones simply loose reception (and we are on two different plans, but we are still in an area of the country that some people have to try the "stand in one place by the window" occasionally to get any reception). And with the changes made to Google Maps lately - where it has just simple taken many small towns and areas off entirely and doesn't even label them it makes it harder to figure out where we need to go. Waze is often useless for us for local drives -- there just isn't enough users to make it useful (and the latest update sort of broke it). So for some local driving, some of the online stuff works, but for anything else the GPS is still useful - plus, it doesn't burn through data!
  • Boyd 1792 Points
    You may not be aware of this, but there are plenty of apps where you load the entire map on your phone, just like a Nuvi. You don't need any cell reception to use these apps and they don't use any of your data plan. Basically, they turn your phone into a dedicated GPS.

    If you read back through this thread, a number of them have been mentioned. StreetPilot is almost identical to the Nuvi but only runs on iPhones. Tomtom, Navigon, HERE and others run on both Android and iOS though.
  • t923347 406 Points
    And the HERE app uses maps that are exactly the same, or near enough, as the maps installed on your Nuvi since HERE provides Garmin with the maps used on the GPS.
  • privet01 145 Points
    The real question for me is what's the gain (sensitivity) of the GPS receiver in the typical smartphone compared to a typical Garmin unit. I do get out of cell phone service while driving. Whether that is material to the way I'm driving I don't know.

    And then I still can't get past the part not having the map displayed in front of me at a critical time, while my wife is taking a call that came in for me.

    Otherwise, smartphones do seem to have overtaken dedicated GPS's. I tend to use my phone for quick intra-city directions. For inter-city travel my nuvi 205w is still my mainstay.
  • t923347 406 Points
    If your smartphone is in a vent mount or something like that, it's visible all the time. If you pair the phone with the bluetooth function in your vehicle then all the calls can come through the cars speakers and the map is still available. Also if you use an app like HERE where the maps are stored on the phone you can use the it without cell service and even if your phone is in airplane mode.
  • Boyd 1792 Points
    edited May 2016
    I think we have covered this before, but recent smartphones have much better GPS chips, and they generally use GLONASS which gives them access to more satellites than any of the Nuvis. In the past, I know Tim has been quick to point out the advantages of the chips and antennas in dedicated devices like the Nuvi.

    But I'm not so sure that's true in 2016, based on personal experience. I made a map of the region around my home using the newest USGS High Resolution Orthophotograhy (HRO). This is the best publicly available aerial imagery and I processed it at the native 1 foot per pixel resolution. This makes for very large files, my map covers less than 100 square miles and IIRC is about 12GB.

    Anyway, I have been using this map with the internal GPS chip in my iPhone 6s Plus recently and am quite impressed. With detailed aerial photography, it's easy to see how accurate your GPS fix is.

    Now I have the Garmin GLO bluetooth receiver that also works with the phone and offers some advantages. However the built-in GPS on the iPhone is more than adequate for any road navigation. I would say it performs at least as good as - probably better than - any of my Nuvis.

    This has nothing to do with cell service, it's a standalone GLONASS GPS receiver. However, as I wrote earlier, the cell signal can augment the accuracy and results in better results navigating in New York City.
  • privet01 145 Points
    t923347 said:

    If you pair the phone with the bluetooth function in your vehicle then all the calls can come through the cars speakers and the map is still available. .

    My car for travel is sixteen years old. Buying a new car to satisfy the Bluetooth integration doesn't work in my cost analysis justifying dedicated GPS or Smartphone. Of course if I happen to have another mid-life crisis, I suppose I might want to put in a new stereo system and at that time I can get the bt. <<grin>>

    (note: I'm just rambling for the sake of conversation. Don't take any of my statements as fact or statement of what is right for you!)

  • Boyd 1792 Points
    Living in a somewhat remote location, I drive a lot and replace cars fairly often. My last two vehicles have had very nice integrated bluetooth hands-free systems - certainly a lot nicer than using a Nuvi as a speakerphone.

    But for those who use a Nuvi as a speakerphone, I don't see any advantage there either. If your phone is your GPS, you don't need a bluetooth link. Just use the speakerphone feature of the phone itself. :)

    Of course, a wired connection from the headphone jack on your phone to the aux input on your car stereo would also work (although those were probably few and far between on 16 year old cars) ;)

    There are also FM transmitters that can send your smartphone audio to a vacant station on your FM car radio (unless your car only has AM radio, LOL). This is like the older Nuvi models with built-in FM transmitters. I always felt that was just about worthless. Anywhere near a suburban area, the FM spectrum is just too full for that feature to work properly. When I had a 50+ mile commute to Philadelphia, I had to switch FM stations 3 times, and the closer I got the worse it got.
  • alanb 374 Points
    My old Buick (2003) actually has a cassette tape player in the head unit. When that car was my main daily driver, I was able to get an adapter that plugged into the cassette slot and had a mini stereo jack. It actually worked pretty good (used it with an Ipod for playing music and with my first nuvi, a 755T which had a stereo jack for audio output.).
  • Zemartelo 102 Points
    For me the only reason why a dedicated GPS Garmin unit doesnt make sense is the cost of those devices
    The low model they have the Drivesmart is over 200 dollars and has basically the same features found on a smartphone with online or offlinemaps. The step up model driveassist which would interest me with the integrated dashcam and the new features added is over 300 dollars and forget the high end model the cost is simply ridiculous.

    As much I would like to replace my 2597 to the driveassist model I cant justify the 300 dollars pricetag anymore for these devices.
    Garmin are pricing themselves out of business imo.
  • Boyd 1792 Points
    For the thousands of units that Garmin sells, they just can't compete on a price basis with Apple and Samsung who are selling (literally) hundreds of millions of phones.
  • sussamb 664 Points
    The cost of smart phones isn't that cheap either, mainly hidden in the cost of the monthly payment for whatever price plan you're on. Of course most have one these days so I guess for them it's dead money.
  • Boyd 1792 Points
    edited May 2016
    Things are changing rapidly in the smartphone arena, and some of the comments in this thread are based on the way things used to be, not the way they are today. I don't know how this works in the UK, but I suspect it is similar to the US now - check it out.

    The days of "subsidized" phones (as you describe) are over. You must either pay in full when you get the phone, or finance it over a fixed period of time. To sweeten the deal, most major companies offer zero percent financing, and you have the option to swap it for a new phone at 6 months before paying it off.

    The cell plan you purchase is completely separate from the cost of the phone. Doesn't matter whether you bring your own phone or purchase a new one from the provider, the cost of the service is the same. I wrote about this above: http://forums.gpsreview.net/discussion/comment/203617/#Comment_203617

    Modern phones and dedicated GPS units are not an "apples to apples" comparison. Phones are not cheap, but they are much, MUCH more powerful than Nuvis (or DriveSmarts or whatever). You get what you pay for…

    New phones are comparable to laptop-class computers with fast CPU chips, as much as 128GB of very fast flash memory, 1920x1080 screens, batteries that run for 8 hours, fast USB 3.0 and 802.11ac wifi interfaces. Comparing these to a Nuvi is like comparing a bicycle to a car. ;)

    Now if you prefer using a dedicated GPS, there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. But don't base your comparison with smartphones on devices from a few years ago, things are changing very fast. :)
  • sussamb 664 Points
    edited May 2016
    That's slightly different from the UK, but the end result is the same. There is never-the-less a 'cost' to the phone, although in the UK the finance over a period of time as you describe it is wrapped up in the monthly fee, which therefore covers the phone and the mobile/cell plan. Or you can buy your own phone (as per the US) and add the mobile/cell plan (SIM only deals as they're called here). Most folks here who own smart phones on a monthly plan think the phone is somehow free, when it's not, and often it's cheaper to buy the phone separately and then opt for a SIM only deal :)
  • Boyd 1792 Points
    Well this might just be semantics…. when you finance the phone it is part of the overall monthly bill, true. But there has been an important change. With the old plans, the carriers (AT&T, Sprint, Verizon) bought the phones from the manufacturers (Apple, Samsung) at full price, then sold them to customers at a discount. They recovered the cost difference over time through a phone contract that the user could not break without paying a penalty.

    That is all gone now, and the reason is that the carriers no longer want to "subsidize" the cost of the phone and recover their loss over a 2 year period. They needed to do this before because smartphones were new and the carriers wanted to entice users to purchase them. Everybody wants one today, so that isn't necessary.

    So while the overall phone bill might look the same as it did before, things are very different. You are not entering into a contract with an early termination fee now. You can quit whenever you want, and if you purchased the phone on an installment plan then all you need to do is pay off the remaining balance.
  • sussamb 664 Points
    edited May 2016
    I think we're in agreement, my point really was aimed at those who say that their nuvi 'costs' them whereas their smart phone doesn't, fact is nothing in life is free and we're paying for it somewhere :)

    Now of course for many they'll want a phone anyway, so if you're simply adding a navigation package of some sort it's certainly cheaper than buying a nuvi/drive.
  • t923347 406 Points
    Boyd said:

    Well this might just be semantics…. when you finance the phone it is part of the overall monthly bill, true. But there has been an important change. With the old plans, the carriers (AT&T, Sprint, Verizon) bought the phones from the manufacturers (Apple, Samsung) at full price, then sold them to customers at a discount. They recovered the cost difference over time through a phone contract that the user could not break without paying a penalty.

    That is all gone now, and the reason is that the carriers no longer want to "subsidize" the cost of the phone and recover their loss over a 2 year period. They needed to do this before because smartphones were new and the carriers wanted to entice users to purchase them. Everybody wants one today, so that isn't necessary.

    So while the overall phone bill might look the same as it did before, things are very different. You are not entering into a contract with an early termination fee now. You can quit whenever you want, and if you purchased the phone on an installment plan then all you need to do is pay off the remaining balance.

    This is not the case in Canada where the major players (Bell, Telus and Rogers) continue to offer, at least on new accounts, a wide number of phones at zero cost or a deeply discounted price with a 2 year term and a minimum data plan.
  • Boyd 1792 Points
    Thanks, didn't realize that.

    I personally welcome the change in the US. I got a new phone last December and at that time I could have gone with an AT&T 2 year contract like I have always done in the past. But I decided not to, I would rather pay $0 down and finance the phone for 0% interest. And in making the switch I changed some things with my plan that resulted in significant savings.

    Too bad you don't have the equivalent of T-Mobile in Canada to shake up the "establishment", LOL :))
    ____________

    www.theglobeandmail.com/report-on-business/big-three-carriers-have-no-plans-for-smartphone-instalment-plans/article26372172/

    Telus chief financial officer John Gossling said the landscape is different in the United States where the largest players Verizon Communications Inc. and AT&T Inc. were spurred into changing their pricing by strong national challengers Sprint Corp. and particularly T-Mobile U.S. Inc., which originated the new pricing strategy in 2013.
  • Kevin_hutch 47 Points
    Our major carrier here in Aus offered me a free phone on a two year contract.
    Then I offered to purchased the phone outright as the monthly fee was the equivalent to paying off the phone twice, the response was because they let me replace the phone each year.
    I guess I could have had two phones by why, nearly caught me out.
  • Boyd 1792 Points
    Here's a nice feature that I just noticed in the StreetPilot app. On the Nuvi, favorites and POI's are always listed based on distance from your current location, we have discussed this at length in the past. Now I noted that the StreetPilot app sorts these things alphabetically, which I prefer.

    But actually, you can choose the sort order using the up/down arrow icon at the top right. This appears on all lists when you search for POI's and favorites. I don't think any of Garmin's dedicated devices have this option, do they?

    image
  • sussamb 664 Points
    edited June 2016
    If they do I've never found it ;)
  • Boyd 1792 Points
    Well here's an option I know that the automotive devices don't have. ;)

    image

    The app lets you disable the warning screen that pops up when you start the Nuvi. I find this curious… presumably the forced warning on the nuvi is something Garmin's lawyers felt necessary. Why would the philosophy be different with the app? Because Garmin doesn't make the hardware?
  • Boyd 1792 Points
    Just reading rumors about the iPhone 7 which is expected to be announced tomorrow. Apparently it will feature an IPX7 water resistance rating. That is the same rating as Garmin's outdoor handheld devices.

    www.macrumors.com/2016/09/03/iphone-7-5-colors-ipx7-12mp-cameras/

    "Improved IPX7 water resistance […] making the device suitable for splashes, showering, and even brief dips in water up to one meter deep."
  • jimmy52 said:

    I'm on my 3rd GPS in 9 years. Current GPS is a Garmin Nuvi. I made the mistake of not updating the maps in over 2 years and have since lost the "Free Lifetime Map Updates". CS says I have to purchase a new Lifetime Map Update or a new Garmin. I made the mistake of thinking that Lifetime Map Updates meant at the very least for the lifetime of the GPS unit. I was wrong....



    That's not the first time the Garmin sheisters have tried to mess with the definition of "lifetime". I'm still using my 13 year old, or whatever it is, Garmin 276C. Last year I couldn't update to the newest map version so I called their tech support and was told that "lifetime" meant lifetime of the device up until they deem the lifetime of the device over. How convenient for them. I even spoke to the boss. I was told that it was no longer possible to update my old 276C because it was no longer compatible with the newest maps. They said that the best they could do for me would be to give me 10% off the price of a new Garmin, their list price that is. It turns out that none of that was true and I am still updating my 276C same as ever.
  • werewolf 107 Points
    edited September 2016
    As for using smartphones or tablets instead of the dedicated GPS, I do have two nice tablets, a Samsung Tab S2 7.9" and 10" which I use with a jetpack, but I'm so used to my 276C , which is almost the same as the 176 I had for years before, that I stick with it. I never learned to use the GPS apps on the tablet tho I experimented with it one day, and I'm afraid the new Garmins with their fancy bells and whistles and nice new features will also lack some features that I now have on my 276 and won't know about until it's gone. Guess I'm not the only one liking the old model because Is see a new old 276C is going for $649 on EBay, sold from Russia!

    http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-GARMIN-GPS-CHARTPLOTTER-MARINE-GPSMAP-276C-GPSMAP-MOTORCYCLE-BOAT-CAR-ATV-/201654359491
  • Boyd said:

    Thanks, didn't realize that.

    I personally welcome the change in the US. I got a new phone last December and at that time I could have gone with an AT&T 2 year contract like I have always done in the past. But I decided not to, I would rather pay $0 down and finance the phone for 0% interest. And in making the switch I changed some things with my plan that resulted in significant savings.

    ....


    Same here and my contract on both my Verizon stoopid phone and jet pack are up in a week or two. The Verizon guy told me they are coming out with a new much faster Jetpack very shortly so I'll wait for that. If u do the 0 per cent interest thing will they autocharge your credit card? If not and they want me to remember to send a payment in each month forgedaboudit because if I forget just once they'll be adding on some big fat late charge.

  • Boyd 1792 Points
    I'm on AT&T, you would need to check with Verizon. But I actually still get a paper bill in the mail every month, just like I did when I had a contract plan. Of course, you can also pay online. AT&T surprised me a few months ago and doubled my data plan at no cost so I'm glad I got rid of the expensive grandfathered unlimited data plan, I always have leftover data at the end of the month.

    What's a Jetpack?
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